JAPAN NEWS AND DISCUSSION
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In an OECD survey of 36 nations on people's perceptions of their living conditions, Japan ranked 21st in terms of quality of life; Australia, Norway and the U.S. were the top 3. What do you think of that?
( 12 )
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The Fukuoka mayor is banning public servants from drinking alcohol for a month; the Osaka mayor has declared war on tattoos on civil servants. What do you think of all this?
( 21 )
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Why do you think Facebook's stock failed to live up to the hype in its trading debut?
( 13 )
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Which sport, when played well, do you think is the most exciting to watch?
( 62 )
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What's the difference between an average burger and a great one?
( 12 )
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- Business Teaching Positions - Part-time - Kanto Region
- Interac, Tokyo
- Salary: ¥3,000 ~ ¥5,000 / Hour
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- National Relief/Substitute Teacher - summer start
- Interac, Tokyo
- Salary: ¥275,000 ~ ¥300,000 / Month
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- 営業パーソン
- 加治金属工業株式会社, Tochigi
- Salary: ¥240,000 ~ ¥350,000 / Month Negotiable
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61 Comments
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neverknow2
It seems to be accepted in the culture by most men and women. It's unlikely a change will come about anytime soon.
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KallyPygous
Have more workplaces in the suburbs where the workers live, where the rents and taxes are probably lower. Should help relieve the transport system a little. Chemically castrate sex criminals.
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weatherjp
Ban passengers on trains.
Poof, groping drops to zero!
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sfjp330
They should run trains until 1 AM to minimize evening congestion. Also in the morning, trains should start one hour earlier.
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realist
Groping on trains is a part of japanese culture. "Chikan" are everywhere, jusdging from the signs you see everywhere. In other countries, there are no such signs, because the general population knows exactly how to deal with such perversions/perverts. There is zero tolerance in other countries, unlike Japan.
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blvtzpk
Single sex carriages on all trains. Seriously. Unless you want to do some serious social engineering regarding men's willingness to touch and fondle strangers in public places. That or lessen the squeeze on trains which allows this type of thing to happen more easily.
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mrsynik
Train women to grope back with a hard knee to the groin of the perpetrator. These disgusting pigs need it, and imagine the loss of face on the train they'd experience!
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diggerdog
change the culture where women are seen as weak and submissive. If i did this in the UK the woman would knee me in the bollocks, head butt me then call the police while stamping on my face. Hey maybe thats why i moved here.
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timorborder
Public amputations. I am actually being half serious regarding such a measure. If there was the chance of losing a body appendage, I think most people would think twice.
Indeed, there is somewhat of a historical tradition in Japan of branding criminals in some way. Back in the Edo Period, certain domains within the country used to engage in the tattooing of convicted felons, both as a punishment and as a warning to others. Such tattoos ranged from a simple band on the arm, while other tattoos were more aggressive. Either way, in a country such as Japan where public image is very important, the mutilation or tattooing of felons would shame such people in the eyes of their compatriots.
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isthistheend
Grope the other person first!
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tangoll
Set aside one car as the "gropers/gropees" car, with a big plastic sheet down the middle lengthwise. Each grope costs 1000 yen from groper to gropee for one minute of groping. Gropers stand on one side of sheet and gropees on the other. Everyone fully clothed, and can wear mask, etc.
Solves a major social problem, and enables gropees to earn hard cash without danger or fear of unwanted sex harassment.
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Tahoochi
diggerdog: your comment made me laugh!
Japanese perverts are taught to be perverts from childhood, (another example would be nudity in mangas available to children) so unless you can change parenting and society in Japan, you will never stop perversion at the source. Everyone's ideas here about deterrence and punishment sound pretty good though. ie. public amputations, castration, or a good ole kick in the family jewels!
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seesaw
Perhaps J women should do the same...!
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buggerlugs
A friend of mine was groped every morning for a couple of weeks but never complained. Just one morning she taped an ikebana spike to her bottom then when groped took a quick forceful step back. Scream ensued, pervert never reported it for some reason. Problem solved. The moral: hurt them so they remember and next time think twice
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kawaiitenshi
I don't really see this as being a topic that deserves to be joked about. Unfortunately I have been a victim to this, and it makes me sick to think the bastards are still roaming the streets without any disciplinary action being taken. When I caused a scene, kicked a guy for groping me I was the one that was treated like the criminal. I think what needs to be done is a task force of plain clothes officers on trains, counseling for those found guilty of groping and seminars held in community centers to tell women it's ok to stand up for yourself, and it's not ok to let someone get away with this... sadly... i don't think the government would waste it's time!
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oberst
have hookers wear " gropee " sign on their ultra mini, 1000 yens to be groped as introductory sampling of the " goods ". Gropers to be awarded coupons count towards going all the way in the love motel.All parties happy............no innocent victims. Hahahhahaaa
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Osakadaz
publicly amputating hands in the middle of Akihabara and Shinjuku with a katana.Second option would be more traditionally Japanese..offenders would have 'molester' tattooed on their foreheads.Guarantee no more chikan.
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kirakira25
Exactly! I am a British woman. Travelled on the tube in London to work for years. NEVER heard of this issue and London trains in rush hour can be just as crowded. Not saying London isn`t more dangerous in a lot of other ways, but most people know what will happen if they try and pull this crap with one of us.
Also - there is a culture in the west for people to stand up and support other people, rather than turning a blind eye to what is going on right in front of them. That has to be a major way to stop the problem.
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kirakira25
My (Japanese) husband has just suggested compact mini-tasers in hot pink, midnight blue or silver glitter in little designer handbags!
And I thought I was the one from the aggressive culture.....!
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studebaker
Easy: Permanent ban from the train company on which the crime occurred. Men unable to ride the train would have to find a new job and new place to live: serious social punishment.
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Blue_Tiger
A left uppercut and a right hook should do the trick on a person-to-person basis, but studebaker has the right idea, also: permanent ban from riding the train, as does kirakira25's husband....
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idicemic
Community service wearin a conspicuously labeled uniform so people know the person committed the lecherous act. Next, a permanently recorded note of the act, printed on their license and on that lovely RFID tag we're looking forward to!
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Omnicron Solaris
I taught my daughter to break fingers. Seems to work and it empowered her. For other less courageous girls.. Someone needs to make a small air powered single use pain marking gun. Maybe something the size of a large ballpoint pen. Air cartridge in the back with a trigger and a small red paint “charge” in the front. The gropee would, when she is being groped, put the pain pen in proximity or contact with the persons hand. Then she presses the trigger. SPLAT and the guy is caught “red handed” so to speak. The girl starts screaming and the station staff/police just have to be on the lookout for a guy with one bright red hand. Of course the paint charge would have to be small or unidirectional to prevent getting it on other people. Free idea to any engineers out there.
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Disillusioned
Holy cow! After reading all these comments I find there are a lot of malicious people contributing to these threads. I too would like to see some sort of malicious punishment for these sickos, but that is not the answer. Sadly, there is no simple answer. This kind of derogatory treatment of women is deeply woven into Japanese history and society. How do you re-educate the male half of a population of 127 million people with a thousand year history of treating women like sh!t?
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timorborder
The comment about breaking fingers reminds me of a Chinese/Australian friend who used to work in Tokyo. Although a real cutie, she is as tough as nails having done old style martial arts under the tutelage of her grandfather.
Anyway, one day she piled into a crowded train here in Tokyo and was the victim of some clown trying to feel her up. Because the train was so crowded she could not match the wayward hand to a particular person so she started snapping fingers. Sooner or later (my friend reckons after she snapped the thumb and then gave it a bit of a loving "massage"), one of the men around her started to break into a serious sweat. She frog-marched this chap off the train (with her hand rammed into his throat) and was walking with him to the police box. Unfortunately, however, the chap also "fell down" the stairs, dislocating his shoulder.
Anyway, after a couple of minutes chatting up the young policemen while the perv sat down groaning beside her, she just went to work and left it up to the cops.
The moral of this story - the next cute girl you feel up on the train might have a black-belt in martial arts.
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dolphingirl
The groping problem is just a symptom of another underlying issue: That woman in Japan are not seen as equals. And in many cases, seen as objects.
To stop this from happening, change has to start from the bottom up. Boys need to be taught to respect girls as equals. And girls need to taught how to stand up for themselves. Also, all kids need to be taught and shown compassion. Adults should set the example by showing concern about their fellow men and women. I doubt that this change will happen quickly
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Manny3
I wouldn't care what other (Japanese) women think. I would definitely beat the crap out of the guy. The fact is that people who are groped are violated. Culture doesn't matter, Human dignity matters. I would teach my daughter a few basic, but effective defensive moves. If I were a woman, I would beat the guy up "East L.A." (Cholo style)!
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Blue_Tiger
Disillusioned, why can't there be a simple answer? Why isn't violence against such cowards so grotesque to some people? I dare-say, if it were someone you loved who had been or was being groped, you'd want to teach the groper a thing or two. If it happened to my wife, especially while I was in her company, I'd teach the groper some manners myself, the "legal" consequences to the flames. I guarantee you that if a woman were to respond with some violence to one of these pervs, they'd think twice about doing it again. Anything less is teaching women to be and to continue as silent victims...
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Cicada
It is time for Japan to reconsider the ban on ownership of firearms. Or possibly the guns could be leased at the ticket counter to female passengers. When they are groped, they simply pull out their gun and threaten to blow the man's head off if he touches them again. This has worked on urban tranport in America and there's no reason to think it would not work in Japan.
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womanforwomen
Does anybody know the psychological reasoning of the color pink and Jmen? i think i dosovered something about the behavior of Jmen - when they see pink, they just really go totally crazy.
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tonkatsuman
Commom sense says it should be taught in the home and at school... However, this isn't only a Japanese problem:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women-onlypassengercar
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Sarge
"How do you re-educate the male half of 127 million people with a thousand year history of treating women like sh!t?"
Break their fingers?
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Anglog1rl
Gender seperate rail carriages is the short term answer. For the long term - Japanese men must move out of the fantasy world of females being there to please them and Japanese women need to assert themselves as human beings and not harbour lowly ambitions to be kept housewives. The world is changing. Close the hostess bars maybe and send the men home to actually grope their own wives and girlfriends. Just a suggestion!
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isthistheend
I think it has a lot to do with at least three factors. 1) The laws. Do any exist against groping; like traffic tickets, escalating fines/ 100,000 for a train feel, 1 million per person for anything worse plus 3 years no suspension of sentence possible, especially by newspaper delivery boys or athletic club members) 2) The culture;patience, gaman, etiquette, walking two paces behind the dude. Some of it was just required to live on these islands. Anyone who's been here long enough must recognize it as an attempt to live here with all the typhoons, narrow areas (40% of the population lives in Kanto; 80% of Japan is mountainous unliveable area; Japn is as big as which state with 1/3 its population). Everyone has bought into the system. Yes the men are friggin crazy groppers, (and smokers), but the women don't face "reality" either. Walking around dressed up like the xxxx slaves they say they don't want to be, puttting make-up on in the trains (hello); pulling their eye-lashes for goodness sakes! Does this happen in other planets besides Mars? 3) The economy (related to one and two)...they get stuck with the short end of the stick and they don't speak up about it. Shikata ga nai. Anyways, groping and smoking are two evils that will not be rooted out in a day. And the following thought just occured to me.."WE, the foreign gaijin community of this place will probably/maybe play a very important and determining part in all this. Or am I being delusional? At least we'll bring it up for discussion. Finally, I think if you ask them about it, they'd respond similar to the way that they say, "WE have no predjudices in Japan." "We have no groping in Japan." "Nobody smokes."
Moderator: Stay on topic please. Smoking is not relevant to this discussion.
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dajtw
I'm not sure on the spot violence is a good idea. I have heard of situations whereby ladies would accuse an innocent person and unless they paid up they would report them. I'm not sure about Japanese law but correct me if I'm wrong, I heard that there are fines for chikan who gets caught?
And with regards to snapping fingers on the spot as well, in a packed train, would you be absolutely certain you got the right person? How would you feel if you snapped a person's finger only to find out later it wasn't the groper?
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seesaw
Gropers are sick, sick people. And they are 'professional' at it, mind you. Please let me tell you of my experience. This is how they do it. In betwen train transfers, so no matter how much I want to knee them in the bollocks it's impossible, because I'm in high heels and they run away so fast....so I now found the best solution is to avoid rush hours....
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ablestmage
I suggest sharp objects in the back pocket (or wherever groping is common). The perp would then probably yelp from the sharpness, and get caught red handed, as it were.
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WMD
Training in some good self defence martial art skills is the answer. Make you strong in body and mind. Why don't they teach self defence skills in japanese schools?? There's nothing more important than that. You have to be strong to survive. Don't take s**t from anyone ladies.
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WMD
Men that molest women on trains are so pathetic aren't they? Deserve a good beating.
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Cos
@WMD, that makes what if you are stronger ? I mean I am able to kill one of those pervs, or even just break them a limb. But in a packed train, I can't move without hurting other people. Even if it is the guy I actually hurt, I would get the problems with justice. Once I did a little action movie stunt on an old wreck that was hugging me from behind, but after he fell on the floor in a resounding "boom" I had to check he was not dead for good and only in a sort of ethlylic coma. I lost a lot of time.
"That woman in Japan are not seen as equals."
Dolphingirl, there is no groping in your country ? You must be from one of those places in Middle East where men and women travel separetely. The problem is more common in Japan because more people take crowded transportation, and for longer hours in the week.
I think only the other people in the crowd can help you. The reaction has to be collective. The guys can do anything as there will be no collective reaction. The victims don't react as they know there will be no collective reaction. So everybody should be "educated". People should learn it is not correct to grope. It is not your fault (there is no shame) if you are groped and you should react imediatly with your voice. And the more important : if someone asks for help and is target near you, you should help and turn against the chikan (the stalker, the pickpocket, the bully, etc).
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GenevaMan
Get all the J-ladies married with foreigners and leave the country, wherever is safer anyway, and in most cases they won't be treated like flesh to have sex with.
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Hephatsheput
The best way to deal with it? Legalize it!
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dolphingirl
Anglog: You raise some good points. This problem would quickly become less of an issue if women were more assertive. You don't have to break the guy's fingers. Just forcefully push his hand away, say 'yamette' in an loud voice and give him a glare. Also, I agree that if men could find sexual satisfaction with their girlfriends, wives and lovers, maybe they wouldn't feel the urge to grab other women. A little self-control is necessary of course too.
cos: Where I'm from is not relevant to my point. You're right that it probably happens more because of over-crowding in trains but it can happen anywhere. In fact, it happened to me in a nearly empty bus in my country. I do concur that this has to be a 'collective reaction'. It's up to everyone to do whatever is in our power to stop another person from becoming a victim.
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bobbafett
public humiliation is enough. Put pictures of those caught in the trains during peak our.
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Azrael
Seriously, I -would- buy one. I have not been gropped (I always keep a sharp lookout, but thankfully now I live in a smaller city and ride the bus to campus instead of a packed train like in Tokyo) but I have been filmed and photographed on trains, train stations and other places and that gets seriously creepy. One time I hadn't even noticed and my friend scared the guy off. Now I wear a chopstick-style hair pin because it can double as an ice pick, should I need to defend myself.
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Azrael
^^; I wrote the line "I want one! In midnight blue!" not Kirakira; the emoticon is the same for quoting and I didn't notice before posting the message.
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Madara
Grope these gropers back with the unforgettable pleasurably excruciating painful experience and don't forget the special treat...the instant/mobile mini guillotine! huh....
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realist
Another solution - women whould be issued with electric cattle-prodders. (This is a small tool for making stubborn cow move their asses.)
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unrested
if you have a train for women who dont want to be groped why not make a train for those who do. win win situation.
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Altria
Fight fire with fire, an eye for an eye, what's good for the goose is good for the gander.
What I'm saying is grope back, harder.
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dbung10
Pretty sure all you need to do is say 'what the hell do you think you are doing?' (any language ok) and make sure that the guy or girl doing it gets shamed into getting off at the next stop. The reason that the gropers get away with it is that nobody calls them out. If this doesnt work (and 99.99% of the time it will) then Im ok with the finger breaking / cattle prod / mini-guillotine ideas.
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rei307
Women should yell; STOP GROPING ME!!
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randomenigma
Which problem? The problem of people doing it, or the problem of girls falsely accusing guys of doing it?
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Simon_Foston
Hephatsheput wrote:
This comment transcends mere tastelessness. Obviously it's another feeble attempt at wit, but if you think that you have to be staggeringly tactless and offensive to be funny, why bother?
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