Catholic Church beatifies 188 Japanese martyrs in Nagasaki

Monday 24th November, 12:56 PM JST

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franz75 at 11:46 PM JST - 24th November

martyrs to some, not for others. Do you care? I don't...
herefornow at 06:13 AM JST - 25th November

franz75, luckily others do care about folks who had such faith in something that they were willing to give their lives for it. Is there anything in your life you feel that strongly about? My guess is a resounding NO. What is interesting is that Japan has a history of people sacrificing their lives for simply a concept or belief, like the samurai and their code of honor. So, I would think most people here should be able to relate to this.
ScottishThug at 06:20 AM JST - 25th November

Idiots on the NBR forum claim that Japanese are not Christian. This puts a nail in the coffin of their bankrupt arguments.
illsayit at 08:58 AM JST - 25th November

More inter-faith dialogue necessary perhaps.
USAFdude at 09:11 AM JST - 25th November

herefornow - First of all, don't get me wrong; my time in Japan was a great part of my life, and I'll always cherish my Japanese friends and their way of life.

That said, I would advise you to be careful about making such statements as:

folks who had such faith in something that they were willing to give their lives for it.

and

history of people sacrificing their lives for simply a concept or belief

As honorable as both of these things seem on the surface, they're equally applicable to kamikaze pilots and suicide bombers as they are to adherents of religion and faith.
Altria at 10:15 AM JST - 25th November

Beatify is an awesome word and should be used more.
taiko666 at 10:46 AM JST - 25th November

USAFdude

You're missing the point that the whole motivation of suicide bombers us to murder other people while 'dying for their faith.' Frankly I'm dumbfounded that you can't see the difference.

The kamikaze issue is another matter entirely. Giving one's life while attacking a battleship bearing down on one's home is a world away from blowing up kids on a train.
franz75 at 11:54 AM JST - 25th November

taiko666: nop. globally they died for what they believe is right.

The Japanese elites viewed the Christian religion dangerous for their own power. Portugese were trying to get enough influence on the Japanese.

Martyrdom belief is dangerous.
taiko666 at 12:59 PM JST - 25th November

globally they died for what they believe is right.

Not disagreeing there, and being agnostic I have no time for religious martydom. But blowing up children is still in a different league from allowing yourself to be killed for your beliefs.

Martyrdom belief is dangerous

And who would you be in more danger from, a tooled-up jihadist on a train or a self-conflagrating buddhist monk?

It's perfectly possible to be anti-religion in general but at the same time realise that not all religions share the same moral values.
ptolemy at 03:31 PM JST - 25th November

Do the self-conflagarating monks of the Soka Gakkai of Showa Era Japan count. They fully backed the war and even wrote hypocrital arguments against their "faith" to support the military govenment and actgions of Japan. Including that Emperor Hirohito was God. For this reason, Hirohito being God, the absolute deity of Shinto at the time, the Kamikaze pilots died. Would they not count as martyrs. The military government used both Buddhists and Shinto in Japan to support the war for the deception of the people. For me that is the problem of any religion, you have to suspend reason to believe the fairy story. Religion is as much a tool in politics as any.

Moderator: Back on topic please.
yasukuni at 10:39 PM JST - 25th November

Not being Roman Catholic I don't have any real personal interest in who gets beatified, but the story of the martyrs of Nagasaki is worth looking into for anyone interested in Japanese history. Amazing people, and the memorial for the 26 martyrs is worth seeing if you go down that way. And Ptolemy, I am no fan of Soka Gakkai at all, and have made that clear here before, but your understanding of Soka Gakkai and the war is totally wrong. In fact it is incredible wrong. Maybe you got the name of the group wrong?? The founder of Soda Gakkai went to prison during WW2. And the SGA people can fill you in on the rest of the story!
yasukuni at 11:02 PM JST - 25th November

SGI
usaexpat at 12:26 AM JST - 26th November

Yeah so the Christians were persecuted in Nagasaki as the Portuguese tried to spread Christianity. They were martyrs to people of the Catholic faith so all well and good. To me personally I wouldn't say those are beliefs worth dying for but to others, well they would disagree.
JoiceRojo at 06:16 AM JST - 26th November

To me personally I wouldn't say those are beliefs worth dying for but to others, well they would disagree.

Maybe not, because you may not understand these beliefs, but I think they died because the believed something different, Catholic faith starts with Jesuscrist martydom, he was persecuted and executed in a cross. They weren't suicide bombers or kamikaze, they were persecuted just because their beliefs, just like in other countries governments persecuted people for having different ideals.
ptolemy at 02:28 AM JST - 27th November

No Yasukuni I didn't and you know I didn't. The Soka Gakkai was tied with old Komeito as it is the "New" Komeito. All you have to do is research, begin with Christopher Hitchen's "God is not Great" all the reference is there. As far as being arrested most of Japan that was not military was at some point and he was released a few months later. Where many others were shot or hung, he had the cash to pay off high people.