China calls on Japan to stop scrambling its fighters

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  • -9

    some14some

    Japan, she said, should instead “show more sincerity and take practical steps to work hard with China to find a way to appropriately manage and resolve the problem through dialogue, talks and consultations. This would be best for both countries.”

    doesn't seem unfair suggestion but can we take it at face value?

  • 25

    Moonraker

    Ha ha, you gotta laugh at China. Next thing, as they land troops on the Senkakus, they will be saying it is "aggressive" or "provocative" for Japan to try to stop it. What kind of looking-glass world do they live in?

  • 20

    nigelboy

    Japan, she said, should instead “show more sincerity and take practical steps to work hard with China to find a way to appropriately manage and resolve the problem through dialogue, talks and consultations. This would be best for both countries.”

    Much like NK. Calling for a dialogue under their conditions as opposed to "stopping" the nonsense first then politely requesting for a dialogue.

  • 0

    lachance

    A common baseline can include a "third way." The Chinese economic downturn has had a severe social impact in Tibet, Uighur and Inner Mongolia, which has been compounded by high food and fuel prices, as well as, in some cases, aggressive ethnic disparity of wealth. Tibet has experienced unprecedented upheaval, and small-scale protest camps have been set up across a host of Tibetan, Muslim and Mongolian cities.

    Instability overall has been limited but, given higher unemployment and poverty, weak growth in the frontiers, prolonged ethnic disparity of wealth and high commodity prices, protests among these nationals are increasing in frequency and intensity (a trend already in evidence in some of Tibet's more economically stricken areas).

    This is bringing into question the survival of provincial governments—and even the nation state. Indeed, even if the Chinese economy recovered meaningfully, resentment over high and rising income inequality in Tibet, Uighur and Inner Mongolia is unlikely to dissipate in the foreseeable future. The risk is that instability will become systemic, with political crises in these former nations affecting other provinces through contagion or through the actions of populist new factions seeking to assert themselves.

    Widespread social and political unrest is already carrying a considerable economic and financial cost to the PRC. The end is near for China, with the Battle of the Senkakus in 2017 signalling the end of Han dominance in Tibet, Uighur and Inner Mongolia.

  • 17

    knowitall

    Note that China doesn't say it will stop sending its planes toward Japan.

    While the actual violation of airspace was a Y-12 prop plane, the majority of flights skirting Japan's airspace are by fighter jets (source: Ministry of Defense http://www.mod.go.jp/js/Press/press2013/presspdf/p2013041702.pdf )

    So, until China says out of Japan's air defense identification zone, the scrambling will continue.

  • 14

    Crazedinjapan

    If China stops sending planes and ships Japan will stop scrambling jets and sending ships. The islands are disputed , china with all of its suggestions should practice what it preaches . These statements were carefully worded to put Japan in a negative view....at just about the right time with Korea spouting nuclear war.

  • 12

    OssanAmerica

    "“We all know that when it comes to the Diaoyu Islands issue Japan has been continuously taking provocative actions to raise tensions."

    This article is hilarious. China keeps sending ships and aircraft into territories it CLAIMS, without having established any legal jurisdiction. By sending in ships and planes without doing so they are violating another countries waters and airspace. Being intercepted and challenged is international protocol. What would China do if some country "claimed" Hainan Island and did the same thing? It's mind boggling that China actually says things like this with a straight face. China is the only taking provocative action in the eyes of he world.

  • 12

    OssanAmerica

    some14someApr. 19, 2013 - 07:23AM JST "Japan, she said, should instead “show more sincerity and take practical steps to work hard with China to find a way to appropriately manage and resolve the problem through dialogue, talks and consultations. This would be best for both countries.” doesn't seem unfair suggestion but can we take it at face value?

    What's mine is mine. And let's negotiate what's yours.

  • -12

    sfjp330

    Containment was designed for a different era, and it is not what the Japan or U.S. should be attempting now. In the past, containment meant economic isolation and deter military expansion involved virtually no trade and little social contact. But China now is not what the Soviet Union was then. It is not seeking global hegemony. Japan and U.S. not only has an immense trade with China but also huge exchanges of students and tourists.

    If Japan treat China as an enemy, Japan is guaranteeing a future enemy. Japan need to keep open the possibility of a more peaceful future. U.S. would accept the rise of China as a “responsible stakeholder.” Unless China is able to attract allies by successfully developing its soft power, the rise in its hard military and economic power is likely to continue to frighten its neighbors. Chinese probably is mistakenly believing that U.S. is in permanent decline and that this presented new opportunities. A result was that China worsened its relations with Japan, India, South Korea, Vietnam and the Philippines.

  • -2

    SauloJpn

    It takes TWO to tango!!!

  • 9

    issa1

    China called on Japan on Thursday to stop sending jets up against Chinese aircraft after Japan said it had scrambled its fighters twice as often in the past year amid a territorial dispute.

    I think they have talent as good comedians.

  • 9

    Probie

    “We all know that when it comes to the Diaoyu Islands issue Japan has been continuously taking provocative actions to raise tensions. This is the root cause of the present very tense situation over the islands,” Chinese Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Hua Chunying told a daily news briefing.

    Hahahahahahahahahahaha!

    This guy is hilarious! He should do stand up or something.

  • 13

    BradG91

    And china wonders why U.S. is still boosting military presence in asia. Quit sending warships and fighters around a place another controls. japan controls them now and they must react to your encroachment on their sovereignty

  • 11

    CrisGerSan

    this is really getting funny, the bully is telling his victim to stop trying to defend himself so that he can be bullied in peace.

    what a joke. Don't the Chinese realize that they are now the laughing stock of the sane world? They live in some sort of bubble where they are convinced of their own propaganda....which is not very good when reality is actually facing you.

    Japan OWNS the islands in question, they ARE NOW JAPANESE TERRITORY. End of story.

    Move On and pay attention to real issues China. What a joke.

  • 7

    fds

    japan should just build a base on that piece of rock already. its what korea did for takeshima, china is doing in the parcels and russia is doing in the kurils. possession is 9/10s after all. once you're there, nothing short of military force or revolution can make you leave.

  • 12

    Dukeleto

    China should stop provoking Japan...simple!

  • 10

    Jason Santana

    China called on Japan on Thursday to stop sending jets up against Chinese aircraft after Japan said it had scrambled its fighters twice as often in the past year amid a territorial dispute.

    REALLY??? Why doesn't China stop violating Japan's Airspace. Japan has clearly laid out where their airspace is. There should be no confusion about this at all.

  • 8

    Dukeleto

    "what a joke. Don't the Chinese realize that they are now the laughing stock of the sane world? They live in some sort of bubble where they are convinced of their own propaganda....which is not very good when reality is actually facing you."

    The problem is the propaganda is aimed internally at the uneducated masses and not at the educated who all know how ridiculous it all is.

  • 3

    issa1

    I dont understand why the Japanese government still maintains diplomatic relations with china. Japan created this monster and still feeds it with Japanese taxpayer money. Its time to cut money from ODA and all kinds of help for china.

  • 9

    KariHaruka

    Stop violating our airspace and we will stop scrambling our jets.

    Come on China try and string a few brain cells together!

  • -10

    Tony Ew

    China is telling Japan to stop embarrassing herself by sending something like eight jet fighters against one Chinese propeller plane. It is very clear to all that Japan's attempt to intimidate China had failed completely. Now with Kerry as Secretary of State we don't hear anymore such brazen acts by Japan. Neither do Japan make any more adventurous stalking of Chinese navy ships within a couple of kilometer in the Senkaku/Diaoyu Islands general area like before.

    In short, China is telling Japan to just calm down and complain to UN or US if needed, no need flexing aggressive military muscles! China have being courteous to Japan with much less frequent 'intrusions'. Japan should learn to appreciate this 'goodwill' and not scrambling the jets help Japan with China making such intrusions even less frequent! Guess some folks don't catch the real intention of the Chinese statement which is to set the stage for a more conducive atmosphere for better relations.

  • 5

    OssanAmerica

    sfjp330Apr. 19, 2013 - 08:06AM JST

    Containment was designed for a different era, and it is not what the Japan or U.S. should be attempting now. In the >past, containment meant economic isolation and deter military expansion involved virtually no trade and little social >contact. But China now is not what the Soviet Union was then. It is not seeking global hegemony. Japan and U.S. not >only has an immense trade with China but also huge exchanges of students and tourists.

    China s seeking regional hegemony. They have openly declared this.

    If Japan treat China as an enemy, Japan is guaranteeing a future enemy.

    Do you honestly think Japan has treated China as an "enemy" in he last 70 years?

    Japan need to keep open the possibility of a more peaceful future. U.S. would accept the rise of China as >a “responsible stakeholder.” Unless China is able to attract allies by successfully developing its soft power, the rise in >its hard military and economic power is likely to continue to frighten its neighbors. Chinese probably is mistakenly >believing that U.S. is in permanent decline and that this presented new opportunities. A result was that China >worsened its relations with Japan, India, South Korea, Vietnam and the Philippines.

    China is underestimating the United States. And it is overestimating it's own capability.

  • -3

    Ravi Tandukar

    Both countries need each other for prosperity, without which there will only be chaos on either side. Neither seem capable of dominating the other completely by military means(at least that is how it appears on paper), so is there any good fighting? Probably both should share it.

  • 5

    Equality

    We all know that when it comes to the Diaoyu Islands issue Japan has been continuously taking provocative actions to raise tensions. This is the root cause of the present very tense situation over the islands, Chinese Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Hua Chunying told a daily news briefing.

    Talk about the 'pot calling the kettle black'! This is one of the best examples of hypocrisy ever!

  • 3

    gogogo

    So stop making a reason China.

  • 2

    issa1

    Ravi Tandukar, Both countries need each other for prosperity, without which there will only be chaos on either side. Neither seem capable of dominating the other completely by military means(at least that is how it appears on paper), so is there any good fighting? Probably both should share it.

    I don't think you're right. Japan has the know-how,state-of-the-art technology to produce in any country. China needs money and technology from U.S. and Japan without it,china is just a sitting duck.

  • 6

    LFRAgain

    China called on Japan on Thursday to stop sending jets up against Chinese aircraft...

    Then stop sending Chinese craft into Japanese airspace and territorial waters to be clearly provocative. A simple solution requiring only a modicum of sincerity and goodwill.

  • 4

    GW

    China REALLY needs tot stop this BS!

    Note to China the rest of the world invested & created you, the rest of the world can UNDO all that as well.

    So start being a little more appreciative & act civily otherwise the rest of the world will have to put you out of our collective misery!

  • 6

    viking68

    Tony Ew: So, you are saying that Japan is defending its territory too strongly, and Japan doesn't need to flex its military muscle. Japan is causing a scene and sullying China's good name.

    The farce continues.

  • 6

    tokyo-star

    I seriously wonder how these Chinese government spokespersons can address the media with a straight face. I LOL every time.

  • 6

    viking68

    Is it goodwill when a bully punches you four times when he could have punched you eight times?

    Is China exhibiting goodwill by not trying to take the islands by force?

    Ultimately, there is no goodwill from China and anyone who says or believes it is deceiving themselves and attempting to deceive others.

    If they could, China would have shot down every scrambled jet and sunk every ship. U.S. and Japanese military strength and China's economic reliance on the world prevent them from this from happening. So, China does act somewhat rationally every now and then.

  • 3

    sn00z3

    Made in China

  • 4

    Eigen

    How about China stop being so boastful and self-righteous and work with Japan for once? If they want to stop Japan from scrambling jets, don't threaten Japanese airspace.

  • 4

    Wakarimasen

    Ridiculous.

  • 1

    splksgt96

    Another WTF China! Get over it you lost the war! Twice 1894-1895 & 1931-1945

  • 0

    moomoochoo

    To resolve this dispute, the island should be given to Australia. We know that Australians were the true owners anyway. Don't agree? Just check our nicely rewritten textbooks!

  • 7

    House Atreides

    "We all know that when it comes to the Diaoyu Islands issue Japan has been continuously taking provocative actions to raise tensions. This is the root cause of the present very tense situation over the islands," Chinese Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Hua Chunying told a daily news briefing.

    As Judge Judith Sheindlin (aka Judge Judy) always says: Don't pee on my leg and tell me it's raining! Japan wouldn't be scrambling their planes if Chinese planes weren't violating Japanese airspace in the first place.

  • 3

    vukodlok

    This is just a diversion by the Chinese government while they continue to poison their own people's food, air, and water.

    People in all lands unite!

  • 0

    habidaccus

    So tired of this topic being used as a diversionfor the true issue...the incompetence of both governments.

  • -12

    Tony Ew

    @viking68

    In this planet Not A Single country recognize Senkaku/Diaoyu Islands as belonging to Japan, oh maybe her 'colonies' friends I won't mention here.

    A psychiatrist can infer that Japan deep down inside feel she don't have sovereignty but cannot say so, so instead manifest her own insecurity by being aggressive like sending eight jet fighters against a small Chinese propeller plane.

    I think reasonable people can understand there is no need to use a sledgehammer when a simple hammer will do and frequently a guilty party will resort to disproportionate actions to hide her own guilt.

  • -9

    Tiger_In_The_Hermitage

    @lachance I was in Guam the other week, if you substatute your comment China = US and tibet = Guam, your comment perfectly applies.

  • 8

    viking68

    Tony Ew, maybe you could point to the survey showing nobody believes the islands belong to Japan.

    Because, it is funny that Taiwan agreed with Japan's rights to the islands by signing the fishing rights agreement. I thought Taiwan was a part of China and could (not willingly by the Taiwanese) be called a colony or friend of China, but Taiwan has recognized Japan's rights to govern the islands. So, recognition of Japan's rights is not limited to Japan's (non-existing) colonies or friends, which it has many friends.

    Psychiatrists? I suppose you are saying Japan has an inferiority complex by using so much force.

    Maybe I have an inferiority complex too, because I personally prefer a sledgehammer to a hammer when talking about territorial integrity or bullies, or in this case a flight of F-15s when someone is trying to take what is yours. It is better to make sure the other side knows you are not willing to play a losing hand. Going in half cocked, so to speak. Some countries, like China, only respect power.

    After all, there is no telling what China will do, it has already used targeting radar on police vessels, has constantly harassed other countries in their own territory, and has even set up a ghost town in the Philippians after forcibly removing people. It is important to prepare for the worst when it comes to China.

    My psychoanalysis of China comes from Steven Tyler: the reason a dog has so many friends is because it wags its tail instead of its tongue. China has only been wagging its tongue.

  • 5

    LFRAgain

    Tigerinthe_Hermitage,

    @lachance I was in Guam the other week, if you substatute your comment China = US and tibet = Guam, your comment perfectly applies.

    Umm, no, it doesn't. Not even remotely.

  • 8

    viking68

    TigerInThe_Hermitage @lachance I was in Guam the other week, if you substatute your comment China = US and tibet = Guam, your comment perfectly applies.

    In what way would it apply perfectly? Guam is doing quite well economically as a result of CHOOSING to be a U.S. territory.

    Tibet wasn't allowed any choices when the Chinese military rolled in. Lesson learned, sending a full flight of F-15s is better than letting your guard down with respect to China.

  • 11

    House Atreides

    And if Japan never taken Chinese lands through the Shimonoseki treaty 1895, there is never needed to send planes from China! This is what is 'in first place' truly means!

    There's no mention of the Senkaku islands in the treaty of Shimonoseki. Why? Because they were never a part of China. On the other hand, small islands like the Pescadores that were controlled by China are specifically mentioned in the treaty. The Pescadores were included in the treaty even though Japan had already seized them prior to the signing of the treaty.

    China never had any effective control over the Senkaku islands. There were no Chinese structures on the islands or Chinese living on them. The first structures on the islands were built by the Japanese. The first domesticated animals on the island were brought over by the Japanese. The first detailed maps of the islands were printed by the Japanese. The Chinese didn't even have detailed maps of the islands until 2012.

  • 6

    jj1980

    Isn't there an old saying; "If you tell a lie long and loud enough, you will eventually start to believe it" ?

  • 4

    ReformedBasher

    Is it just me or with China being so defensive, are they trying to back down without losing face? I can only hope that they are being this sensible. Hopefully it is they who will ask for dialogue when the situation defuses enough.

  • 4

    SecularBeast

    Hilarious double-speak from the CCP. They've gotten so used to having a brutalized and unquestioning audience at home who are forced to swallow whatever hogwash they spew forth ('or else'), that they operate under the delusion that the rest of the world will swallow their empty and absurd rhetoric as well.

    It must be confronting for the poor souls in the CCP to run into people who are capable of arguing against their nonsense, questioning their modus operandi, and strong enough to resist their bullying and stand-over tactics. The CCP lives in its own reality bubble where it can do no wrong, and these kinds of patently absurd statements show the bubble is in serious danger of being popped.

  • -6

    Olegek

    Hard times for Japan , eh?

    Economical stagnation for 20 years, Fukushima, China declare its new position...NK rocket&nuklear tests....

  • -4

    Olegek

    To splksgt96

    Another WTF China! Get over it you lost the war! Twice 1894-1895 & 1931-1945

    Sorry in anno 1945 Japan loose war against China

  • 6

    Chamkun

    *

    China calls on Japan to stop scrambling its fighters???*

    Then Japan calls on China to stop sending its ships and plains to Japan Territory.

  • 5

    OssanAmerica

    Otago1000Apr. 19, 2013 - 12:43PM JST @Eigen: If they want to stop Japan from scrambling jets, don't threaten Japanese airspace That was NOT Japan's airspace! Japan has taken that island and sea since 1896, last year Japan advanced to take >the airspace of that district! Thats why China sending warships to Diayou island to memorize the signing of >Shimonoseki treaty! The war drum is beating and this is not a game!

    Japan "took" the islands in 1985 from nobody. Chinese maps from the 1950s and 60s show them as Japanese territory. China's arguments are fabricated and motivated by strategic and economic motives. China has taken no action to legitimize their claim, yet they continue to violate the waters and airspace as if it saying it is theirs makes it so. It doesn't. Your posting of propaganda is merely an attempt to justify China's aggressive territorial expansion, which the entire world doesn't buy. And please stop war mongering, it's really distasteful.

  • 5

    OssanAmerica

    Tony EwApr. 19, 2013 - 12:43PM JST @viking68 In this planet Not A Single country recognize Senkaku/Diaoyu Islands as belonging to Japan, oh maybe her 'colonies' >friends I won't mention here.

    The entire planet accepts that the islands are under Japanese administration. Not one country on this planet besides China itself accepts China's claim to them. Not even Taiwan.

  • 6

    OssanAmerica

    OlegekApr. 19, 2013 - 04:34PM JST To splksgt96 Another WTF China! Get over it you lost the war! Twice 1894-1895 & 1931-1945 Sorry in anno 1945 Japan loose war against China

    No, that's what the CCP government in China teaches it's people. In 1945 Japan lost the war to the Allies headed by the United States and the Republic of China as a member. in 1949 the Chinese Communist Party chased Chiang Kai Shek (ROC) out of China to Taiwan. The Peoples Republic of China (CHINA) did not win any war against Japan. It did not exist in 1945.

  • 1

    knowitall

    And why Japan never calls Russian to stop sending Tupolev95 bombers CIRCLING around the entire nation of Japan?

    Isn't this article about China asking Japan to stop defending itself? As far as I know, the Russians don't tell Japan to stop scrambling fighters.

    But if you want to talk about Japan's complaints about Russia, yes government protested the incursion into Japanese airspace last year. Don't you read the newspaper? In fact, Japan scrambled fighters against Russian approaches to its airspace 248 times last year. Like China, Russia actually went as far as violating airspace once last year. This is something that has been going on for decades. Both Russia and Japan know how to play the game. But occasionally, the Russians are caught offsides...

  • -1

    Ron Barnes

    It don,t matter the politic of this, But Japan Needs China To Help Control North Korea It Would Be in Japans and China Interests To Negotiate a Shared Agreement on this area. For get about the war bit it is senseless history . No one wins a war . As other country,s have to provide for the rebuilding .That is what happened in Japans Case. Also this Bit about Annexing some Islands, Looks a Very Suspicious way to Aquier Territory not actually Japanese Government owned. But citizen owned . What would you do to Australia in Areas that Japanese Citizens and Company, s Own property, Annex those. too., I hope one can see my point without being offended. We have greater problems With the Enviorement . Japan has it unstable Tectonic plates to worry about more so. Causing problems to their Nuclear energy supply,s.

  • 0

    msmahumane@gmail.com

    Let us all celebrate the prediction of our great prophet Lachance; hoping that all what he predicts about China will happen in our life time. I can see the time when all of us shall scramble to inherit the remaining bit and pieces, all led by our great prophet Lachance

  • 1

    Dylan Otoshiro

    > CrisGerSanAPR. 19, 2013 - 09:16AM JST Move On and pay attention to real issues China. What a joke.

    That's just it. Aside from the obvious fishing and gas reserves, this whole exercise I feel may be a ploy to distract the ordinary Chinese from the very real and very serious issues arising domestically.

  • 5

    knowitall

    And when did the United Nation Security council EVER condemned China for aggressive actions? Tell me the No. of resolution, please!

    Now that is just an utterly ridiculous statement. It is impossible for the Security Council to condemn China. Why, you ask? PRC has veto power in the Security Council. So, China would have to approve any condemnation of itself.

    Oh, China is definitely expanding its territorial claims. For example, they think they own the ocean up to the coast of the Philippines!

  • 1

    OssanAmerica

    Otago1000Apr. 19, 2013 - 08:46PM JST China's aggressive territorial expansion??? And when did the United Nation Security council EVER condemned China for aggressive actions? Tell me the No. of >resolution, please!

    The Perm UNSC , on which China itself sits usually vetoing anything the US advances, does not have to condemn a country for it to be considered conducting "aggressive actions". China's aggressive actions towards the Philippines, Vietnam. Malaysia, Vietnam and Japan and the complaints from those countries, as well as news sources other than Chinese state controlled media, is ample evidence of China's aggression.

  • 0

    Serrano

    How much has this dispute cost Japan already?

  • 1

    Saketown

    If Japan halts sending Fighter Jets aloft in order to stop the Communist incursion of the Senkaku Islands, then the "Free Nations" in the Western Pacific risk a Communist Takeover of their islands and we (The U.S. & Japan) will not let that happen

    Communist China can Kick and Scream all they want, but the Pivot to push for Freedom, Democracy, Peace, and Prosperity in Asia will not stop.

    We will not be threaten or intimidated by Communist Agression wether it comes from China, North Korea or anyone else who wants to step into the ring and have a go at it.

  • 2

    nigelboy

    Japan formally took control of the Senkaku Islands during the First Sino-Japanese War (1894-1895), citing government land surveys confirming that the islands were uninhabited. After losing the war, China signed the Treaty of Shimonoseki in 1895, which ceded “the island of Formosa (Taiwan) [and all islands] belonging to said island of Taiwan.

    The Japanese government confirmed way beforehand that the islands were "uninhabited" for an individual named Koga had been operating his commercial activities there since the early 1890's. The three survey during that time leading up to the incorporation confirmed that the islands were not under any control of Qing, hence it was deemed terra nullius.

    This distinction became important after World War II, when the Treaty of San Francisco nullified all previous treaties, returning previously ceded territory to Chinese control. According to both China and Taiwan, the Senkaku Islands were not incorporated into Japan before 1894, and should have been included in the returned territory.

    Their claim to the islands came after the underwater resources were discovered. It's a convenient "after the fact" claim which has no basis since Republic of China, who is a party to the Potsdam Declaration, did not contest the ownership during the negotiations which lead up to the Treaty of San Francisco.

  • 2

    OssanAmerica

    Otago1000Apr. 19, 2013 - 09:31PM JST Before the first Sino-Japanese war 1894, In 1890 and again in 1893, the Okinawa government called on Tokyo to set >up markers to lay claim to the deserted islands...etc etc etc

    All this is irrelevant to the issue of China conducting an aggressive harassment program of sending ships and planes into Japanese waters and airspace. If China has a claim they can file an action at the ICJ. To be intruding into another country's space without doing so is simply lawless "bullying".

  • 4

    Altruist777

    I live in western Europe and the majority of people here don't have positive view on China because of China's such behaviour. China should instead use their silly aggressive behaviour to clamp down on their counterfeit goods production !

  • 4

    gelendestrasse

    That's the problem both NK and China have, they spew propaganda so often that they start to believe their own lies.

  • -4

    Olegek

    I live in western Europe and the majority of people here don't have positive view on China because of China's such behaviour. China should instead use their silly aggressive behaviour to clamp down on their counterfeit goods production !

    I live in Russia and majority of the people here don't have positive view of western Europe because of aggression against Serbia , Iraq, Lybia, Afganistan , Syria... Is it wise aggressive behavior ?

  • 0

    HokoOnchi

    They should enter into a truly 50/50 arrangement to exploit the sea bottom resources. The two countries together can guaranty the safety of that area far better than any one of them alone anyway.

  • -3

    Olegek

    Tom Saketown Communist China can Kick and Scream all they want, but the Pivot to push for Freedom, Democracy, Peace, and Prosperity in Asia will not stop.

    Qui vivra vera....

  • 2

    Saketown

    @Olegek

    "Veni, Vidi, Vino"

    (I came, I saw, I got drunk)

    Capitalism...right back at ya shipmate :)

  • -1

    sfjp330

    To claim Diaoyu Islands was terra nullius makes it hard for the Chinese to prove they were there at some times when the Japanese say their ‘10-year survey’ revealed the islands had no inhabitants. This is an absurd claim by Japan as Diaoyu is barren rock islets and no sane people would make life of living there, as the conditions were harsh. There was no such name as Senkaku in 1895. Since the Japanese name of Senkaku was originated in 1900, what name did the Japanese use in 1895? Japan used the Chinese name Diaoyu and claimed the islands as terra nullius. If it was terra nullius in 1895, why did Japanese needed to used the ancient Chinese name until 1900? No wonder Okinawa goverment refused to lease Daioyu to Noda prior to 1895, because they knew that the Diaoyu islands belong to China.

  • 0

    sfjp330

    nigelboy Apr. 19, 2013 - 10:28PM JST It's a convenient "after the fact" claim which has no basis since Republic of China, who is a party to the Potsdam Declaration, did not contest the ownership during the negotiations which lead up to the Treaty of San Francisco.

    In the 1972 Okinawa Agreement that grants Japan the rights of adminstration and not sovereignty. In 1978, China and Japan PM Fukuda accepted the fact that "the dispute of Senkaku/Diaoyu Islands shall be posponed". This was first Japanese representative to admitted that there was dispute over the islands. If Japan has clear ownership like you say, why did your former PM and the J-goverment admitted that there is a dispute? We know today, Japan goverment retracted by saying "there is no dispute".

  • 2

    OssanAmerica

    sfjp330Apr. 20, 2013 - 03:33AM JST To claim Diaoyu Islands was terra nullius makes it hard for the Chinese to prove they were there at some times when >the Japanese say their ‘10-year survey’ revealed the islands had no inhabitants. This is an absurd claim by Japan as >Diaoyu is barren rock islets and no sane people would make life of living there, as the conditions were harsh.

    Except that a Japanese Bonito factory and people lived there. The remains of that settlement are the only remnants of any human habitation on the islands.

    There was no such name as Senkaku in 1895. Since the Japanese name of Senkaku was originated in 1900, what >name did the Japanese use in 1895? Japan used the Chinese name Diaoyu and claimed the islands as terra nullius. If >it was terra nullius in 1895, why did Japanese needed to used the ancient Chinese name until 1900?

    The Okinawans and Japanese called them nanes like Uwotsuriujima, Taishotou, Kubashima, etc. They were never called by the Chinese names.

    No wonder Okinawa goverment refused to lease Daioyu to Noda prior to 1895, because they knew that the Diaoyu >islands belong to China.

    PM Noda was not alive in 1895. Have no idea what you are talking about,

    Again, arguments supporting China's claim are irrelevant to this article. China has not taken any legal actions to validate it's claim. It has no right to be sending ships and planes there in an attempt to harass and "bully" a smaller country into submission.

  • 2

    nigelboy

    To claim Diaoyu Islands was terra nullius makes it hard for the Chinese to prove they were there at some times when the Japanese say their ‘10-year survey’ revealed the islands had no inhabitants. This is an absurd claim by Japan as Diaoyu is barren rock islets and no sane people would make life of living there, as the conditions were harsh.

    No. Their survey indicated that there was no evidence that Qing ever had control or administered the islands. This is also evident by the fact that Koga was able to operate his commercial business on the islands without any disturbance or inquiry from the Qing government.

    There was no such name as Senkaku in 1895. Since the Japanese name of Senkaku was originated in 1900, what name did the Japanese use in 1895?

    False. The term "Senkaku" was used by Japan's Navy report in 1873.

    Japan used the Chinese name Diaoyu and claimed the islands as terra nullius.

    No. Japan used "Uotsuri" for one of those islands. Don't know what Chinese called those "sets" of islands for it appears they didn't have one.

  • 2

    nigelboy

    In the 1972 Okinawa Agreement that grants Japan the rights of adminstration and not sovereignty.

    "...Japan is willing to assume **full responsibility and authority for the exercise of all powers of administration, legislation and jurisdiction over the territory **and inhabitants of the Ryukyu Islands and the Daito Islands"

    Read the entire text.

  • -2

    sfjp330

    nigelboy Apr. 20, 2013 - 04:05AM JST "...Japan is willing to assume **full responsibility and authority for the exercise of all powers of administration, legislation and jurisdiction over the territory **and inhabitants of the Ryukyu Islands and the Daito Islands" Read the entire text.

    The Chinse stance was backed by the U.S. interpretation affirming the strict neutrality of the U.S. in this dispute and stating that the agreement does not prejudice the ownership of the islands. China's failure to protest may never invalidate a valid title to territory. In the 1972 Okinawa agreement between Japan and U.S. clearly does not comprise a transfer of title.

  • -2

    sfjp330

    OssanJapan....In 1893, the Empress Dowager Cixi granted the Daioyu Islands to Sheng Xuanhuai who was the Chief Minister of the Court of Imperial sacrifices at that time. Being also a businessman in the pharmaceutical sector, he was keen on harvesting the plant "statice arbuscula" on the Daioyu Islands. The Chinese used these herbs to manufacture pills to prevent high blood pressure and relieve pains because of dampness. Being thrilled about the effectiveness of the pills, the Dowager Cixi awarded three of the disputed islands to the Chinese pharmacologist. This decree carried the imperial seal thereby making it official. By virtue of this imperial act the three mentioned islands could have become Chinese property. At least the Qing Dynasty recorded officially the existance of the islands.

  • 4

    nigelboy

    In the 1972 Okinawa agreement between Japan and U.S. clearly does not comprise a transfer of title.

    It shouldn't. For instance, Koga was able to maintain the "title" to the island despite having the administrative, legislative, and judicial powers transferred to U.S. from Japan after the war.

  • -3

    sfjp330

    nigelboy Apr. 20, 2013 - 04:02AM JST No. Their survey indicated that there was no evidence that Qing ever had control or administered the islands. This is also evident by the fact that Koga was able to operate his commercial business on the islands without any disturbance or inquiry from the Qing government.

    Until the 1894, the Japanese could not make any progress regarding the incorporation of the islands. In the letter response to the Director of the Prefecture Admin Kazuyuki, the Okinawa Govenor stated that no investigation had been carried out so far on the (Daioyu) islands. In his request, Kazuyuki wondered as well whether there was evidence such as old records that demonstrate the islands belong to our country. The question if the official Japanese information contain factual distortions that can be left open, at least the contention is not beyond resonable doubt.

  • 4

    OssanAmerica

    sfjp330Apr. 20, 2013 - 04:34AM JST OssanJapan....In 1893, the Empress Dowager Cixi granted the Daioyu Islands to Sheng Xuanhuai who was the Chief >Minister of the Court of Imperial sacrifices...

    Clearly you missed the part where I stated: " arguments supporting China's claim are irrelevant to this article. China has not taken any legal actions to validate it's claim. It has no right to be sending ships and planes there in an attempt to harass and "bully" a smaller country into submission." So it doesn't matter if Ming the Merciless granted Fanatsy Island to Zhiang Ziyi or whatever. China has no legal basis to be sending in ships and planes into those waters and airspace. Therefore to complain about being challenged in accordance with internationally accepted protocol,

  • 3

    nigelboy

    Until the 1894, the Japanese could not make any progress regarding the incorporation of the islands. In the letter response to the Director of the Prefecture Admin Kazuyuki, the Okinawa Govenor stated that no investigation had been carried out so far on the (Daioyu) islands. In his request, Kazuyuki wondered as well whether there was evidence such as old records that demonstrate the islands belong to our country. The question if the official Japanese information contain factual distortions that can be left open, at least the contention is not beyond resonable doubt.

    Who said anything about Japan claiming the islands based on lack of "old records that demonstrate the islands belong to our country"?

  • 2

    nigelboy

    ....In 1893, the Empress Dowager Cixi granted the Daioyu Islands to Sheng Xuanhuai who was the Chief Minister of the Court of Imperial sacrifices at that time.

    Except for the inconvenient fact that Sheng Xuanhuai was not a 太常寺正卿 at that time. Also, the Imperial script has no specific date (just date and year) which has never happened in the past. In addition, such grant was never recorded in neither Qing Shilu (Chinese: 清実録), Donghualu (Chinese: 東華録), and Donghua xulu (Chinese: 東華統録).

  • -4

    sfjp330

    OssanAmerica Apr. 20, 2013 - 04:50AM JST China has no legal basis to be sending in ships and planes into those waters and airspace. Therefore to complain about being challenged in accordance with internationally accepted protocol,

    Just another example of Japan being resentful of the military manuevers within a disputed islands which Japan acknowledged in 1978, and has no soverignity over and claiming hurt feelings and intimidation. Since when is Japan's insecurity blamed on someone else and called intimidation?

  • -4

    sfjp330

    In 1895, the Japanese Cabinet decision is the main evidence for Japanese claim. However, this Cabinet decision omitted the Chiwei Yu Island. This means that this cabinet decision raises doubtful questions. This cabinet took the decision under secrecy and no other country, not even the concerned China was informed. The cabinet decision's wording reinforces the idea that Japanese officials did not conduct the surveys, rather they were private expeditions. If the surveys were privately run, then these actions cannot be accredited to the Japanese goverment. This might be a hint that the Japanese position contradicts with historical records.

  • -3

    sfjp330

    nigelboy Apr. 20, 2013 - 05:20AM JST Except for the inconvenient fact that Sheng Xuanhuai was not a 太常寺正卿 at that time. Also, the Imperial script has no specific date (just date and year) which has never happened in the past. In addition, such grant was never recorded in neither Qing Shilu (Chinese: 清実録), Donghualu (Chinese: 東華録), and Donghua xulu (Chinese: 東華統録).

    The Decree of Empress Dowager Cixi of 1893: "The medical pills submitted by Sheng Xuanhuai have proved to be very effective. The herbs used in making the pills are said to have been collected from the small island of Diaoyutai, beyond the seas of Taiwan. It has come to my knowledge that the said official's family has maintained for generations pharmacies offering free treatment and herbs to destitute patients. This is really most commendable. The three islands of Diaoyutai, Huangwei Yu, and Chwei Yu are hereby ordered to be awarded to Sheng Xuanhuai as his property for the purpose of collecting medical herbs. SEAL OF QUEEN MOTHER CIXI.

    Source: U.S. Senate, "Agreement with Japan concerning the Ryukyu Islands and the Daito Islands", Congressional records, 92nd Cong, 1st session, 40161 (microfiche)

  • 3

    House Atreides

    China's official position in 1950 was that the Senkaku islands were a part of the Yaeyama islands.

    The Ryukyus "consist of three parts--northern, central, and southern. The central part comprises the Okinawa islands, whereas the southern part comprises the Miyako islands and the Yaeyama islands (Sento islets)."

    An article published by The People's Daily on January 8, 1953 titled "Battle of people in the Ryukyu Islands against the U.S. occupation" stated:

    "The Ryukyu Islands lie scattered on the sea between the Northeast of Taiwan of China and the Southwest of Kyushu, Japan. They consist of 7 groups of islands; the Senkaku Islands, the Sakishima Islands, the Daito Islands, the Okinawa Islands, the Oshima Islands, the Tokara Islands and the Osumi Islands."

    In 1950, China, the United States and Japan were all in agreement that the Senkaku islands were a part of Okinawa. The only country that changed its position was China, in 1972, when ownership of Okinawa reverted back to Japan.

  • 3

    nigelboy

    Source: U.S. Senate, "Agreement with Japan concerning the Ryukyu Islands and the Daito Islands", Congressional records, 92nd Cong, 1st session, 40161 (microfiche)

    ??? They were merely translated into English which happens to come from that source. We're talking about the authenticity of this decree.

  • -8

    sfjp330

    House Atreides Apr. 20, 2013 - 07:39AM JST In 1950, China, the United States and Japan were all in agreement that the Senkaku islands were a part of Okinawa.

    Where did you get this info? China does not recognize the Treaty of San Francisco because they were not a party to it.

  • 5

    House Atreides

    Where did you get this info?

    It's from the Chinese diplomatic draft written by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the PRC on May 15, 1950 which referred to the Senkaku Islands by the Japanese name "Senkaku shoto" and "Sento Shosho".

    Here's the title of the document in Chinese: http://www.webcitation.org/6DGS7W8Eg

    The article published by The People's Daily on January 8, 1953 titled "Battle of people in the Ryukyu Islands against the U.S. occupation" serves as further confirmation that the 1950 document was the official position held by China.

  • -6

    sfjp330

    House Atreides, The 1950 credibility 'discovered' and 'believed to be authentic' papers" are propaganda from Japan and nobody in the international community talks about it even for a minute. It's worthless.

  • -5

    sfjp330

    House AtreidesApr. 20, 2013 - 07:39AM JST in 1950, China, the United States and Japan were all in agreement that the Senkaku islands were a part of Okinawa.

    By the way, who represented U.S. and what was his title in this 1950 meeting you are referring to?

  • -5

    sfjp330

    It is possible that Japan lost its title of sovereignty by virtue of Taipei Treaty in 1952. In Art. 4 of the treaty, the Japanese conceded that all treaties prior to 1941 became void as a consequence of the war. We know that PRC does not recognize Taiwan and rejected any agreements. However, the Taiwanese with Treaty of Shimonoseki in 1895, Taiwan, together with all the islands appertaining to Taiwan was ceded to Japan. Consistantly, it was illegal to hand over the Diaoyu and other islands appertaining to Taiwan to the U.S. The Taipei treaty caused a nullification of the 1895 treaty.

  • 5

    House Atreides

    The 1950 credibility 'discovered' and 'believed to be authentic' papers" are propaganda from Japan

    It's ridiculous to dismiss something as "propaganda from Japan" when less than three years later, we have the People's Daily publishing an article referring to the the Senkaku Islands as being a part of the Ryukyu Islands.

    "The Ryukyu Islands lie scattered on the sea between the Northeast of Taiwan of China and the Southwest of Kyushu, Japan. They consist of 7 groups of islands; the Senkaku Islands, the Sakishima Islands, the Daito Islands, the Okinawa Islands, the Oshima Islands, the Tokara Islands and the Osumi Islands."

  • 6

    Sofa_king

    If your dogs stop coming into my yard I'll stop chasing them out. Simple.

  • -7

    Tony Ew

    @viking68 @OssanAmerica

    Round and round we hear this country support Japan, that country support Japan, BUT where is the DEFINITIVE statement that say Japan have sovereignty over the Senkaku/Diaoyu Islands? Does your dear friend US says so? Does even Taiwan, Vietnam, Philippines say so in Black & White?

    It is this lack of definitive pronouncements by these countries that is Prima Facie PROOF that Japan do not have sovereingnty over the Senkaku/Diaoyu Islands. Funny this is so hard to understand. Maybe embarassing myself is a better response?

  • -6

    Tony Ew

    @OlegekApr. 19, 2013 - 04:24PM JST

    Hard times for Japan , eh?

    Economical stagnation for 20 years, Fukushima, China declare its new position...NK rocket&nuklear tests....

    I see a parallel with the rise in Japan militarism before WWII ! Great job pointing out the aggressive military actions taken by Japan is a harbinger of something even worse! Next thing you know, Abe succeed in changing the Japanese Constitution and then Japan become a nuclear power! I hope people learn the history of Japan in the decade before WWII and understand we have a serious problem down the pike!

  • 4

    SecularBeast

    @Tony Ew - International law recognize Japan's rights over the islands. If China has a problem with it, they have to deal with it at an international level. The CCP can do whatever it wants at home and spin any party line to a captive audience to justify its actions (and send in the military goons if anyone objects), but it can't get away with that kind of approach in international relations.

    It doesn't matter how big or how rich China is, the CCP has to understand that internationally they are 'just another nation', and cannot unilaterally lay claim to whatever area of sea or land they want anymore than Fiji or Mongolia can. At an international level the CCP are acting like diplomatic amateurs, as these latest statements reveal.

  • -6

    Tony Ew

    @Otago1000Apr. 19, 2013 - 05:32PM JST

    And why Japan never calls Russian to stop sending Tupolev95 bombers CIRCLING around the entire nation of Japan? The Russians message was even more dangerous if compared with China, China sent fighter jets at most! A defensive measures Japan has no rights to denial when their F15 jets flying like cowboys!

    I have being wondering ALOUD too! I dearly wish to see a comparative same day Russian and Chinese 'intrusion' and see if Japan acts as a bully against China but act very timid when it comes to Russia!

    Japan should just make much less noise whenever China 'intrude' and hopefully China reduce the frequency even more as can be seen in recent trends. A calm passive Japan is the best way for world peace. Don't take that as a sign of weakness, but of wisdom esp when China don't actually invade the disputed islands!

  • -6

    Tony Ew

    @SecularBeastApr. 20, 2013 - 12:05PM JST

    @Tony Ew - International law recognize Japan's rights over the islands....

    Please re read my comments on lack of support for Japan's claim to sovereignty even if you throw the law books at me! THEN conclude in your own mind the common sense of it all. Your statement is akin to Israel claiming Jerusalem with ' international law support her claims' and did any country agree? Enough said!

  • -2

    Olegek

    Saketown @Olegek

    "Veni, Vidi, Vino"

    (I came, I saw, I got drunk)

    very self-critical

    Capitalism...right back at ya shipmate :)

    So US paid back 16 billions of debts - I missed something ?

  • -4

    Olegek

    sfjp330

    In the 1972 Okinawa Agreement that grants Japan the rights of adminstration and not sovereignty. In 1978, China and Japan PM Fukuda accepted the fact that "the dispute of Senkaku/Diaoyu Islands shall be posponed".

    It was a wise decision

    To change situation was very provocative

  • -1

    Olegek

    Tony Ew

    I see a parallel with the rise in Japan militarism before WWII !

    Only one difference - Korea now is not occupied by Japan and both Korean states have a stron armies

    And Chine is not weak and decentralized as in was in 30 th ....

    And Japan hasn't stron Army&Navy anymore ...

  • 2

    OssanAmerica

    sfjp330Apr. 20, 2013 - 05:28AM JST "OssanAmerica Apr. 20, 2013 - 04:50AM JST China has no legal basis to be sending in ships and planes into those waters and airspace. Therefore to complain about being challenged in accordance with internationally accepted protocol,"

    Just another example of Japan being resentful of the military manuevers within a disputed islands which Japan >acknowledged in 1978, and has no soverignity over and claiming hurt feelings and intimidation. Since when is Japan's >insecurity blamed on someone else and called intimidation?

    What in the world are you talking about? Your comment males no sense. China is sending ships and planes into waters and airspace that it has no legal right to do, and Japan is responding in accordance with internationally accepted protocol. End of story,

  • 2

    OssanAmerica

    sfjp330Apr. 20, 2013 - 08:35AM JST House Atreides, The 1950 credibility 'discovered' and 'believed to be authentic' papers" are propaganda from Japan >and nobody in the international community talks about it even for a minute. It's worthless.

    Very poor response in the face of overwhelming evidence.

  • 2

    OssanAmerica

    Tony EwApr. 20, 2013 - 11:02AM JST @viking68 @OssanAmerica Round and round we hear this country support Japan, that country support Japan, BUT where is the DEFINITIVE >statement that say Japan have sovereignty over the Senkaku/Diaoyu Islands? Does your dear friend US says so? >Does even Taiwan, Vietnam, Philippines say so in Black & White?

    It doesn't matter Tony Ew. What is fact, and China now knows this, is that regardless of China's point of view, the only way they are going to take the Senkakus is by militarily confronting the United States, which we all know they do not want to do. So arguing about "sovereignty" is a waste of time.

  • 2

    OssanAmerica

    Otago1000Apr. 20, 2013 - 02:51PM JST @Ossan: intruding into another country's space without doing so is simply lawless "bullying" Yes I got what you mean! Your principle is simple: Sending a manned aircraft to international airspace is defined >holding a hostile act from China no matter those flights has violated or not violated Japanese airspace since she has >never recognizing Japan sovereignity over Senkaku islands was a kind of 'lawless' and "bullying"!

    Invallid comparison. The Japanese Administration of the Senkakus is recognized globally other than those which have claims. That would be China. And Taiwan if it can be considered a sovereign country. Neither have taken any legal action to validate their claims. If your argument is that China has a right to enter Japanese waters and airspace because it doesn't "recognize" Japan's control then you must also accept Japan's right to intercept and challenge such Chinese flights in accordance with international protocol since Japan doesn't "recognize" China's claim.

    But if China be 'wise' enough sending an unmanned drone with undetectable feathers like the US has done to Iran, >the RQ170 incident to do 'sneaky things' deep inside another country is no violation of any international laws and thus >it is NO lawless "bullying"!

    China is free to do so. We would love to shoot one down and see who you copied.

  • -2

    Tony Ew

    @OssanAmericaApr. 20, 2013 - 10:08PM JST

    Tony EwApr. 20, 2013 - 11:02AM JST @viking68 @OssanAmerica Round and round we hear this country support Japan, that country support Japan, BUT where is the DEFINITIVE >statement that say Japan have sovereignty over the Senkaku/Diaoyu Islands? Does your dear friend US says so? >Does even Taiwan, Vietnam, Philippines say so in Black & White?

    It doesn't matter Tony Ew. What is fact, and China now knows this, is that regardless of China's point of view, the only way they are going to take the Senkakus is by militarily confronting the United States, which we all know they do not want to do.

    So arguing about "sovereignty" is a waste of time.

    Oh my! I got to grow a few more neurons to understand this line of thinking. So help me God!

    For added reference what does US, UN maps says about ownership of Senkaku/Diaoyu Islands? You are welcome to have the Last Word!

  • 2

    OssanAmerica

    Thanks Tony Ew.

    They say under Japanese administration. They do not say "Chinese territory under Japanese Administration. They certainly do not say "Chinese territory".

    In contrast, the Southern Kuriles are shown as "Japanese territory under Russian administration".

    I do hope God helps you.

  • 0

    Teachmeteachyou

    Ha ha ha! so they want the freedom to fly right close to and even (at least once) violate another country's airspace and then to be left alone to do this. Some UN member! It's true it was provocative of Japan to buy them from their private owner, but this was done to prevent the even worse move of Tokyo's Governor doing so himself.

    More communication is necessary. China's tactics are senseless, though and just looking at their desire to expand into other 'disputed' territories shows Japan is right to be vigilant.

  • 2

    OssanAmerica

    TeachmeteachyouApr. 21, 2013 - 10:18AM JST It's true it was provocative of Japan to buy them from their private owner, but this was done to prevent the even worse >move of Tokyo's Governor doing so himself.

    No it's not true. The Japanese government has owned one of the five islands for decades. That never "provoked" China. The United States used the island for live fire bombing practice and that never "provoked" China. Now the Japanese government guys 3 of the islands from Japanese nationals in order to keep Ishihara from building on them ad that "provoked" China? Make any sense to you? Or did China simply use that as an excuse to start their territorial expansion offensive against Japan?

  • 3

    HonestDictator

    @Tony Ew/Otago1000/sfjp330 you can complain here all you want for your mother China, but you're not going to convince people outside of China when the majority of the world agrees that the Senkaku islands belong to Japan. Case closed, China is never "getting back" what they think they "own" how many centuries ago. The rest of the world besides Japan has historical proof and international legal support that the islands belong to Japan. China's "historical proof" only exists in China. PRC's lies can only convince a captive audience, not those with the ability to think for themselves.

  • -6

    boilthebunny

    The islands are under dispute. Japan is clearly the aggressor by laying claim to them with F-15's.

  • 6

    OssanAmerica

    boilthebunnyApr. 22, 2013 - 02:02AM JST The islands are under dispute. Japan is clearly the aggressor by laying claim to them with F-15's

    Really? Give us the ICJ case name. Where is the dispute other than China simply saying so? I can claim your car and try to take it. If you try to stop me would YOU be the aggressor?

  • 0

    bajhista65

    This is just plain drama. Someone is behind this BS in the business of selling armaments. Your guess is as good as mine. And you know who they are.

  • 3

    Triangle-of-Cake

    They'll undoubtedly tell the Filipinos to not scramble their jets as they sail into northern Luzon.

  • 3

    JoeBigs

    China called on Japan on Thursday to stop sending jets up against Chinese aircraft after Japan said it had scrambled its fighters twice as often in the past year amid a territorial dispute.

    They are very funny and really really child like in their game, they keep testing Japans resolve to defend it's territory and complain when Japan shows strength.

    I cannot wait for Article 9 to go bye bye and really give some teeth to the Japanese response.

  • 3

    Chamkun

    Otago1000

    It has nothing to do with the war. Japan started to do research 1885 if the islands (Senkaku) were recognized as TERRA NULLIUS by the international law. China never has registered them and confirm that fact to Chinese government then. After that, Senkaku became the part of Ishigaki county Okinawa.

    You seem like history, Ming Dynasty, 13 emperors left 3058 volumes of their political record which is a very important objective historical evidence.It shows clearly that Senkaku was not the territory of Ming Dynasty.

    1871, after the Miyakojima incident that 54 Japaneses were beheaded because the boat was wrecked from Typhoon and landed there , Japan complained to Qing Dynasty, they denied that the generally the areas were not governed by them. Senkaku has even smaller and farther, how China today could say Senkaku has been China since ancient time with this double standard saying. China today could not complain Japan how lawfully registered Senkaku as the part of Okinawa in 1895.

    Even if China really found the island around 600AD? as they say. The based on judicial precedent in an international law. Island of Palmas Case. The title by geographical approach-ability does not have a meaning in the international law.Discovery itself is immature origin of rights to obtain a sovereignty in international law which is inchoate title.When a foreign country begins to use realistic sovereignty and a discovery country does not protest, the title which uses sovereignty is only larger than the title of discovery. Any territorial issue must be with laws not what I think base. Other wise, the world today will be in mess. In this case, 250 Japanese people lived on the island and had a dry bonito factory. The SF treaty article 3 states Senkaku is Japan, and no country has complained the article 3. Except China after the potential oil was found in 1968. China's claim is based on the aggression and so emotional without any hard evidence. Stop sending the ships and plains before China says to Japan stop scrambling.

  • 2

    Chamkun

    boilthebunny

    The islands are under dispute. Japan is clearly the aggressor by laying claim to them with F-15's

    The dispute which is produced by China. 1978, more than 100 fish man boat came into the area with machine guns into Japan territory based on laws. Which is aggressor? It is hard to believe in China 1978, the civilians can do such an activity without any problem with the government.

    Japan has a right to defend. This is a defense action not aggression. Each time, we are losing our tax money. But it is inevitable unless China stop doing this.

    If China really think Senkaku is China, instead of sending their military ships and plains, sue Japan. Japan can win 100%. That why they are producing the issue based on their unilateral maritime law promulgated in 1992 in China which has no effect to the world.

  • 3

    JanesBlonde

    "show more sincerity" - Chinese Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Hua Chunying

    Yes Japan, please follow the Chinese Communist Parties example of how to be open, honest, transparent, caring, humble and above their ability to genuinely "Show more sincerity".

    I love these statements from China, they always make me chuckle.

  • 1

    House Atreides

    Even if China really found the island around 600AD? as they say. The based on judicial precedent in an international law. Island of Palmas Case. The title by geographical approach-ability does not have a meaning in the international law. Discovery itself is immature origin of rights to obtain a sovereignty in international law which is inchoate title.

    There's an island off the coast of Alaska called Japonski Island. It's called Japonski Island because the first people the Russians encountered on the island were Japanese. Does this mean Japonski Island was Japanese? Does this mean Japan could make a claim to the island? The answer of course is no. On the other hand, had there been Chinese on the island and the island named Kitaiski Island, you can bet the Chinese would be demanding not only the island but claiming Alaska as well.

  • -3

    Octagon

    Chamkum

    I have seen your countless debate about Japan ownership issue for territory. May be more than a year now. Japan has been adminstering it since 1971. Japan has not developed any sustainable commercial project. Another word is Japan is not making money. Japan is losing money for the national pride. Imagine there was a joint exploration for natural gas with all parties, tax payers are getting the return.

    Reality is Japan is landlord in name only who has insecurity. Reality is PRC and Taiwan ships have come and go since 1960s. That year is 2013. Unless all parties can settle for postive compromise, Japan or China will keep losing money for that dispute. It is time for making money and swallowing the national pride.

  • 1

    House Atreides

    It is time for making money and swallowing the national pride.

    This issue isn't about national pride. It's about national security.

  • -2

    Athletes

    This issue isn't about national pride. It's about national security

    As a unconditional surrenderer of WWII, Japan has no luxury for national security. It has only national insecurity. Germany has shrinked a lot after WWII. Unlike Japan, Germany has been getting well with neighbors. While Germany is enjoying steady growth and low unemployment, Japan has been in recession since 1991.

    Senkaku may be under Japan control. However it is very frustrating to watch PRC and ROC ships come and go as please. Legitimate landlord should be profiteering from property. Not the pointless counter productive confrontation.

  • 2

    House Atreides

    Senkaku may be under Japan control. However it is very frustrating to watch PRC and ROC ships come and go as please. Legitimate landlord should be profiteering from property. Not the pointless counter productive confrontation.

    Why doesn't China show how its done? Why aren't the Chinese in negotiations with the Philippines with respect to Mischief Reef or Vietnam vis-a-vis Woody Island? Chinese overtures aren't fooling anyone.

  • 0

    HokoOnchi

    During the Cold War American and Soviet scrambles happened all the time. Both surface and submarine naval vessels played tag as well. Somehow, no one pushed the button.

    One would hope that both Japan and China actually have responsible military commands know not to cross the line.

    Question is whether Xi Jinping has more control over the military than his precessor.

  • 4

    OssanAmerica

    AthletesApr. 23, 2013 - 01:49PM JST "This issue isn't about national pride. It's about national security"

    As a unconditional surrenderer of WWII, Japan has no luxury for national security. It has only national insecurity.

    Are you kidding? The US has guaranteed Japan's security.

    Germany has shrinked a lot after WWII. Unlike Japan, Germany has been getting well with neighbors. While >Germany is enjoying steady growth and low unemployment, Japan has been in recession since 1991.

    Germany gets along with it's neighbors because they aren't the world's largest authoritarian communist state that uses anti-german sentiment as a political tool. Recessions over, best get with it.

    Senkaku may be under Japan control. However it is very frustrating to watch PRC and ROC ships come and go as please. Legitimate landlord should be profiteering from property. Not the pointless counter productive confrontation.

    The ROC (Taiwan) is only interested in natural resources and are willing to negotiate, and they have already started. The PROC (China) on the other hand is on a territorial expansion program to allow it's Navy to gain strategic dominance in the South and East China Seas with a goal of full pacific operation. China is not fooling anyone.

  • -1

    Olegek

    OssanAmerica Germany gets along with it's neighbors because they aren't the world's largest authoritarian communist state that uses anti-german sentiment as a political tool.

    Germany HAS regulate relationships with West but not with Russia ...So - surprisingly Russia VS Germany has almost the same questions as China VS Japan....

    Japan as Germany think - we are so good and democratic ... NOW ... but not 70 years before SO the discussion is NOT about modern political sys - good or bad - it's out of question problem - the old crimes....

    The PROC (China) on the other hand is on a territorial expansion program to allow it's Navy to gain strategic dominance in the South and East China Seas

    China want to control Chinas Seas - REALLY DANGEROUS !

  • -1

    Olegek

    HokoOnchi Question is whether Xi Jinping has more control over the military than his precessor.

    Problem is not bad Xi Jinping or bad chinese generals ... problem is deeper much more deeper

  • 0

    HokoOnchi

    OlegekApr. 25, 2013 - 01:39AM JST

      HokoOnchi Question is whether Xi Jinping has more control over the military than his precessor.
    

    Problem is not bad Xi Jinping or bad chinese generals ... problem is deeper much more deeper

    Depends upon what we are talking about. I am talking about whether this current state of cat and mouse can be maintained without triggering a war. At one time, the US and the Soviet Union had a number of close calls in the air and on or under the seas but the military commands were professional enough and under the control of their civil governments to prevent escalation. That's the question I have about Xi Jinping. I think the military command in Japan is better known and understood.

    On the other hand, of course, there are political histories involved so that it won't be the military command that is the issue but the civil governments themselves. But I was not making reference to that as far as the current "aerial" issue is concerned.

  • -1

    Olegek

    At one time, the US and the Soviet Union had a number of close calls in the air and on or under the seas but the military commands were professional enough and under the control of their civil governments to prevent escalation

    Some info 'bout uncontrolled chinese military elite ?

    At one time, the US and the Soviet Union had a number of close calls in the air and on or under the seas but the military commands were professional enough

    it was such a good thing as the separation of the spheres of influence

    It exist today no more

    US pretend to control whole world....

    here the problem ....Chinese sea - US sea

    Japanese sea - US sea .... and so on...

  • 0

    HokoOnchi

    The question is whether the military command in China is controllable by the civil government as well as we would want to avoid a war.

    This does not mean that they are uncontrolled. The concern is, when given operating orders, how much free thinking may be applied by the command structure? How professional are the military in not making political decisions on the fly? The Russian and American military have long experience in this area. In relative comparison, the PLA's history is short on international encounters.

  • 0

    OssanAmerica

    OlegekApr. 25, 2013 - 01:37AM JST "OssanAmerica Germany gets along with it's neighbors because they aren't the world's largest authoritarian communist state that uses anti-german sentiment as a political tool."

    Germany HAS regulate relationships with West but not with Russia ...So - surprisingly Russia VS Germany has almost >the same questions as China VS Japan....

    Russian and not even the old USSR, had mandatory education that included vilification of Germany, an already defeated country. Nor has Russia ever used anti-German sentiment as a political and diplomatic tool. Your comparison makes no sense.

    Japan as Germany think - we are so good and democratic ... NOW ... but not 70 years before SO the discussion is >NOT about modern political sys - good or bad - it's out of question problem - the old crimes....

    As you correctly say, 70 year old history is NOT modern poltical issues. And China (as well as South Korea) need to get over it and stop using it like is's a current event.

    "The PROC (China) on the other hand is on a territorial expansion program to allow it's Navy to gain strategic dominance in the South and East China Seas"

    China want to control Chinas Seas - REALLY DANGEROUS !

    The use of the name "China" for certain bodies of water does not mean they own it. Is there anyone who thinks Mexico owns the Giulf of Mexico? Or India owns the Indian Ocean?

  • 0

    Athletes

    Ossan

    Are you kidding? The US has guaranteed Japan's security

    You misunderstood about what I meant about the insecurity. Insecurity for Japan not only about territory but also economy too. US has guratnteed before! However it is struggling to pay the salaries of off shore service men and women. Reality is it will be broke more if it is keeping the sweet promise. Japan has been facing the moutain of debt. It is too broke for paying more checks for sustaining that sweet promise.

    Many Japanese understood about US lid service. Therefore they have always insecure about US sweet promise! Treaty is changeable whatever US want. Pls ask native Americans and Mexico.

  • -1

    Olegek

    OssanAmerica. Russian and not even the old USSR, had mandatory education that included vilification of Germany, an already defeated countr

    Sorry for long of topic - yes it had - I can sware upon it - because I have personal expirience : from Soviet/Russian school I know very well that central event in Russian history - German invasion of 1941

    And I know from Soviet/Russian movies how devil looks like - it's a German soldier armed with MP 40 on the background of tank T VI - Tiger and burninng Russian country house....

    The main symbol of Germany (Europe) for Russians - Adolf Hitler

    Deep at heart Russian believe that all Germans are Nazis

    And so on ....

    Nor has Russia ever used anti-German sentiment as a political and diplomatic tool. Your comparison makes no sense

    The MAIN and most important Russian national holiday - 9 th May - Day of Victory over Nazi Germany

    All things associating with this Great National War are sacred and much more important than even Ortodox religion ....

    SO - this Victory is not politics in Russia it's Russian religion... like some sort of Armageddon ...in which we are not only survive but win ...

    one more time sorry for a long off topic ...

  • -1

    Olegek

    "The PROC (China) on the other hand is on a territorial expansion program to allow it's Navy to gain strategic dominance in the South and East China Seas" The use of the name "China" for certain bodies of water does not mean they own it. Is there anyone who thinks Mexico owns the Giulf of Mexico?

    Gulf of Mexico is under full control of US NAVY.... the same thing for all other waters surrounding US...

    What's the problem with China ?

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