Heavy snow continues in northern Japan
TOKYO —
Heavy snow continued to blanket the Sea of Japan coast in northern Japan and the Hokuriku region on Sunday. The Japan Meteorological Agency warned that the heavy snow was likely to continue until Feb 3 as a winter pressure pattern lingers.
According to the Meteorological Agency, Yamagata had 3.24 meters of snow, Niigata had 2.5 meters, and Aomori City recorded 1.29 meters of snow, as of 6 p.m. on Sunday.
Meanwhile, police and emergency services have urged citizens to be careful when clearing snow from rooftops, NHK reported. Experts suggest that people should tie a lifeline around themselves when on the rooftop to prevent slipping. Residents should not clear snow by themselves and need to be careful of snow protruding over rooftops like eaves, NHK reported. Pedestrians are also urged to be aware that gutters covered in snow are dangerous.
So far this year, 40 deaths due to snow-related deaths have been reported in Japan, the National Police Agency said.
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22 Comments
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0
JeffLee
As for advice, here's mine: "Stay off your effing roof in the first place, you idiots!!!" I lived in the Canadian prairies, and going on the roof in winter would be considered psychotic behavior there. How many houses in Japan collapse from snow on the roof every year? It's crazy that authorities are condoning this dangerous and unnecessary practice by giving on advice on how it should be done.
-1
borscht
Good question. Can anyone or JapanToday investigate this and give us a figure?
2
smartacus
Wooden thatched houses can be very precarious indeed if snow piles up on the roof. You do have to clear it off.
0
JeffLee
"Wooden thatched houses can be very precarious indeed."
I saw this on NHK last night, and the house being demonstrated was modern, with a hard roof.
2
wanderlust
The average Japanese house is so poorly insulated that the snow on the roof paradoxically helps them retain heat!
-4
Yubaru
This yearly phenomenon of people dying because of falling off of roofs is stupidity at it's best!
Moderator
Readers, please refrain from posting vicious remarks like this.
7
zichi
I lived for 8 years, deep in the Japan Alps and never cleared the snow off my art studio roof because it was too dangerous and I thought it probably helped to it warm. But every winter there are always a few cases of collapsing roofs on old houses.
0
Wurthington
At this point, with so much snow already on the ground... falling off of one's roof shouldn't prove life threatening unless you can't dig yourself out of the snow you fell into. In addition... why did they build houses with flatish roofs in the first place? In a place lie that the roor should be at a much steeper angle.
0
psychopathsareincontrol
snow snow snow It's so intiguing to someone who's grown up with no snow at all (only a couple short holidays to snowy areas)
0
CrazyJoe
I believe this has nothing to do with houses collapsing. The snow must be removed to protect what's underneath and below. Can you imagine if the snow landed on your head?
2
Yubaru
CrazyJoe, some houses roofs are unable to stand the weight of the snow and do indeed collapse, this snow is heavy, not the powdery stuff that often falls when the temps drop.
And yes it needs to be removed to prevent it falling on things underneath as well.
I still maintain that if the houses were properly insulated, heated, and designed correctly this would not happen. I have lived through storms that dropped 2 feet of snow at one time and NEVER did a single house roof cave in, all homes were centrally heated, with angled roofs and the internal temperatures kept the snow from accumulating on the roofs.
Icicles were another matter though.
0
CrazyJoe
@Yubaru
Actually I am not aware of any houses in northern Japan collapsing due to the snow. They must have strict roof standards. But I do see your point.
0
wipeout
Yubaru, "I still maintain that if the houses were properly insulated, heated, and designed correctly this would not happen. I have lived through storms that dropped 2 feet of snow at one time and NEVER did a single house roof cave in, all homes were centrally heated, with angled roofs and the internal temperatures kept the snow from accumulating on the roofs."
How does a house's internal temperature prevent snow accumulating on the roof if it's a properly insulated house? Surely the requirement to prevent snow would be a warm roof, which would be due to lost internal heat from the house, which is equivalent to poor insulation?
Also, in many areas of Japan, two feet is nothing. People get a lot more than that, and they may actually know what they're talking about. Who's to tell some cat from deepest Yamagata how to shovel snow? He knows already.
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JohnBecker
Wipeout, good luck finding a properly insulated house in Japan.
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JeffLee
There are lots of besso (cottages) in Niigata, Nakano, etc, which are uninhabited much of the time and they accumulate huge piles on their roofs. They tend to be lightly constructed. Are their roofs caving in? Not from what I've ever seen during my numerous ski trips to such places.
If "snow collapse" were a real threat, it would be a documented issue in the construction industry, etc. There would be "snow collapse prevention" businesses, etc., and not just in Japan but in other snowy regions of the world. But no.....
Blame Japanese aesthetics. Houses must look "clean," ie, devoid of nature. It's the same impulse that in summer prunes all the branches off trees, cuts hedges down to an inch high, strips away vines and grass and favors the free use of smooth, bare and "clean" concrete.
0
wipeout
JohnBecker, I think you missed the point. Someone apparently contradicted himself by referring to houses (not in Japan) that are both properly insulated and yet have the internal temperatures prevent snow accumulation on the roof. I asked him for clarification. Heard nothing so far, so to me, it's still contradictory.
To your own point, I'd need to know exactly what your standards are concerning proper insulation. There are ways to measure it, the technical details of which I'm not intimately familiar with as yet. Perhaps you are though.
Of the new houses in Japan I've looked at in the past couple of years, all were double glazed and insulated. Every single one.
0
JeffLee
@wipeout: yes there is a technical grading system for insulation, and new Japanese housing uses materials with among the lowest grading around. Old Japanese houses use no insulation at all.
What's more, there are no mandatory standards in the housing building code to maintain energy efficiency. Japanese developers install the lightest (and cheapest) insulation and then in their marketing state the house is "insulated."
0
wipeout
Yes, but do you have anything other than continual negativity to offer in a discussion, or are you just sick of this place? Times change Jeff, and the people I know who are building or now or who have recently built their houses got the level of insulation they wanted. They had to pay, but they were satisfied with the results. I have seen a lot of houses in the last couple of years because I'll be going through this too eventually, and I will be aiming to get what I need. And it has never been presented to me as something that's not possible - quite the opposite. But you've probably been into this subject in much more depth than me.
You have, right?
2
zichi
Traditionally, Japanese homes were built to deal with the heat of the summer rather than the cold of the winter. I live in a 90-year-old traditionally built house, wood frame and mud walls. Fortunately it was built by a rich family so the main beams are very thick, 18" to 24".
It withstood the bombing of WWII and the 1995 Kobe earthquake. The sea side of Kobe is warmer in the winter than the mountain side. No snow.
There's no insulation which makes it a little cold in winter but in the summer its cooler than some modern houses with insulation. We don't need to use much ac.
0
JeffLee
@wipeout Yes, I once spoke with an executive for a foreign maker of insulation, who was trying to market his products in Japan --and having great problems doing so. Most Japanese customers don't investigate the grading of insulation, he said, so they're stuck with thin insulation. But, sure, insist on high rated insulation and make sure they do the ceiling, not just the walls.
"Are you just sick of this place?" Thanks for that comment, as it signals you've lost the argument on the issues. In fact, if I didn't care, I wouldn't bother commenting -- or thinking -- about ways of improving our situation here. I would also ask the moderator to delete your comments, since they're directed at my character and aren't relevant to the issues under discussion.
0
wipeout
It's no comment on your character, Jeff, However, your comments are very negative, with you kicking off this thread by calling people idiots. Now you want the discussion moderated....
Some of your comments are simply speculation. Just because you think things are done a certain way in the Canadian prairies does not mean the same conditions apply or should apply halfway across the world in Japan where people are digging themselves out of three and four metres of snow. Heavy snow loads on roofs do indeed cause structural damage, it was an issue in Boston last year after two-foot snowfalls (discussed in the press with reference to residential roofs, and snow also caused the collapse of a commercial building, which you can see on Youtube). Larger falls than those are routine and frequent in any Japanese winter along the Japan sea coast prefectures, in Tohoku and in Hokkaido. This year is even worse than usual. It isn't about what you see on your ski trips, it's about what people in these areas live with every day, and my money's on them understanding the conditions better than people enlivening a slow morning at work with comments on JT.
Even in the US, people advise that three feet or more of snow on a roof is considered risky and is better removed.
http://askville.amazon.com/seriousness-snow-load-roof-hold/AnswerViewer.do?requestId=1015681
So yes, it is a documented issue in the construction industry. And roofs in Japan get a lot more than three feet - even double or triple. And they get cave ins, whether or not you accept that it happens.
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