China accuses Japan of smear campaign over radar incident

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  • 1

    Okinawamike

    It is believed the island chain, which is also claimed by Taiwan, sits atop vast mineral reserves

    Until proven, why keep this crap up? All fun and games, until someone loses an eye.

  • 19

    kimuzukashiiiii

    “Recently Japan has been hyping up crisis and deliberately creating tension to smear China’s image."

    Um ... no China, your doing that all by yourself.

  • 5

    sfjp330

    Who is telling the truth? Rather than the propaganda of China in the 1960's, if you have a beef, the Defense Minister of China should provide accurate, verified log of the Chinese frigate. Will China provide accurate information as to what led the Chinese frigate locked its weapons-targeting radar on a Japanese warship or continue the as a victim of cold war propaganda fairytale story? Will Chinese provide a sailing direction of the frigate that was in close proximity to the Japanese military ship? Was the Japanese frigate ship minding their own business in international water or the Japanese ship threatened by dangerous manuver of the Chinese ship? If China really can prove Japan is harassing in the area why don't China report it?

  • 13

    rogoteye

    Good luck with that story, China!

  • 2

    sfjp330

    Article states: “Supervising and governing seas under the jurisdiction of China is the main responsibility of Chinese marine surveillance staff,”

    Yes you are, China is supervising and governing seas by locking weapons targeting radar in international waters. Maybe other countries should follow China's procedure. I don't believe that China's civilian goverment has any control over their military. They do what they please.

  • 6

    Tamarama

    sfjp330

    Yep, you are spot on. The Japanese vessel will surely contain data that has recorded and logged the incedent - I'm sure it will be very easy to provide the proof/intelligence to that effect, which they will share with the likes of the US.

    China are playing this mad double game - at once ratcheting up the tension and pressure continually whilst blaming Japan non-stop. Right now, the only people they are convincing are their own.

  • 5

    ChibaChick

    Not saying they didn't do it though, are they?

  • -13

    Athletes

    Tamarama Feb. 08, 2013 - 07:31AM JST

    Right now, the only people they are convincing are their own

    I am not Pro China or Pro Japan. As a bias free person, I will not convince one sided story either. Maritime navigation is risky business. Using Sonar sounder for other ship moving direction is acceptable for some cases.

    If two ships are speeding or one is following other, there will be higher risk for collision. If radar locked for navigation safety instead of firing intended target, it is acceptable for me. I will not accept if it has used for accuracy for targeting firing range.

    Bats are blind with very limited vision however they can fly inside narrow cave without hitting wall. It is identical with navigation safety assisted by Sonar sounder.

    If the Captiain Cook who was a martime expert still alive today, he will agree with my post.

  • 10

    hidingout

    This is rich coming from the propaganda champions of the world. I guess some folks don't like it when their own tactics are used against them.

  • 4

    T-Mack

    Radar shows bearing and range to anything without locking, Once you lock on , fire control takes over, and is ready to launch weapons or fire guns...You can take it as a threat, or as an improper gesture, like flipping someone the "California Bird"...

  • 3

    nigelboy

    Poorly written article in a sense that question was asked about the validity of radar lock itself but Hua chose to deflect the issue by stating "please screws that question to the appropriate department". WTF??? You are a spokesperson for Foreighn Ministry, are you not???!!!

  • -2

    FightingViking

    Together with the above article on the "Northern Territories", it's beginning to look more and more like WW 3... (Just like spoiled kids, when they can't agree, they fight...)

  • 4

    tokyo-star

    Not saying they didn't do it though, are they?

    Hah! Didn't they say that Japan is blowing the incident out of proportion?!!

    Isn't locking on a "direct threat" by international standards? Same as pointing a loaded gun.

  • 4

    YuriOtani

    T-Mack it is also known as the "Hawaii happiness gesture", I do not believe the Peoples Republic of China for a moment. They are trying to dupe a SDF ship into firing first or return the favor. Then they will fire upon the SDF ship.

  • 0

    Probie

    Beijing accused Tokyo Thursday of mounting a smear campaign after Japan said a Chinese frigate had locked its weapons-targeting radar on a Japanese warship in a “threat of force.”

    Why else would you lock on weapons-targeting radar, if not as a “threat of force”?

  • 4

    Frungy

    “The current problem is not China being assertive but about Japanese ships’ and airplanes’ repeated illegal activities in the airspace and waters of the Diaoyu islands, which undermine China’s territorial sovereignty.”

    So basically China is saying they did it, but it's okay since Japan is violating their territory somewhere else ... Umm... not very convincing. That would be like Japan arguing that because China sent ships into their territory they should feel free to lock weapons radar on any Chinese ship anywhere at any time.

    The problem with China's "defence" is that if they open fire they same logic applies, "Japan invaded our territory, so we opened fire". Can no-one else see that China is building a rationale for war?

  • 1

    Yubaru

    China accuses Japan of smear campaign over radar incident

    And Japan could have just as easily made the same accusations towards China over all the protests in China and the Chinese press who press the issue in Washington DC as well.

    But Japan didn't did they?

    Who is being the child here China?

  • 4

    Neo_Rio

    The Chinese want to goad Japan into firing the first shot... ....the unfortunate thing is that, if they don't get that, nothing's stopping the Chinese from firing first and then claiming self-defence anyway. It doesn't seem unlikely given what we've heard so far. They're sticking to their own narrative.

  • 6

    Virtuoso

    Almost anything written about China that happens to be true can probably be taken as a "smear."

  • 7

    paulinusa

    I've stated this before. The Japanese government has strict control of the JSDF. Can the same be said of the Chinese government and their military?

  • 3

    rickyvee

    it's interesting that china isn't denying that the incident took place. instead they are trying to accuse japan of ratcheting up tensions over "their" islands.

    and there is no chance that china would ever attack a japanese vessel of any type because the US explicitly stated that it will defend japan in all instances.

  • 1

    Yubaru

    The Japanese government has strict control of the JSDF.

    Quite so, as evidenced by the rammings last year, this is petty in comparison, but more dangerous in the larger picture because it is a military craft and not some fishing boat. (Which should have been blown to hell and back)

    I doubt the Japanese government could respond fast enough to a request by a ship captain to return fire if an incident occurs that demands a response. The meetings alone would take weeks to come to a conclusion.

  • 8

    viking68

    Just incredible. No wonder China is friends with N. Korea.

    In direct response to a question about "threat of force", China blames Japan for smearing their name by publicizing their China's actions. Do they believe their own lies? I saw the news conference and they are not very good at lying. The woman also didn't seem like she believed what she was saying.

  • 14

    gogogo

    So China enters Japanese waters, turns on their weapons radar, points it to a few ships and planes.... and all this is Japan's fault?

  • -22

    FPSRussia

    I believe China completely. It is definitely a smear campaign. Unlike the rest of you I've sat at the console for surface and air tracking radar on board an Aegis cruiser. There are multiple types of radar used for tracking. Aircraft squawk an IFFF signature. Ships that don't identify themselves are often focused on.

    Because the Japanese ship was in China's territorial waters they have every right to paint any vessel especially since tensions are at an all time high.

    Japan's proganda which by the way is related to this topic is the source of friction. Forget about the natural resources. Neighboring nations will not tolerate Japan trying to expand as it did during its Imperial days. The days of the Empire of Japan are done. Quite simply the wounds haven't healed and now Abe is putting salt in them.

  • 5

    nigelboy

    Because the Japanese ship was in China's territorial waters they have every right to paint any vessel especially since tensions are at an all time high.

    FPSRussia,

    Can you tell me approximately where they were and your source please?

  • 7

    Yubaru

    Because the Japanese ship was in China's territorial waters they have every right to paint any vessel especially since tensions are at an all time high.

    How many times does it have to be pointed out to you that the islands in question are not Chinese? The Chinese vessels were in Japanese territorial waters, the captain of the Chinese ship is very lucky that his opponent was Japanese and not an American ship captain, the results would not have been pretty if push came to shove.

  • -1

    25psot

    UN would be more helpful to solve this issue , even if it means giving Japan control of this island from Monday to Friday and Chinese can go there on the weekends.

  • -19

    Tony Ew

    I am really glad China come out swinging! No, me NO 50 cents army, please don't tar me again.

    Japan should release ALL helicopters, navy ships movements EVERY TIME Chinese ships pass through that area on the way or come back from the Western Pacific doing naval exercises. This is the only way we can learn the truth instead of buying the sound bites from the Japanese government!

    Here is some news from the Chinese side: http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/760701.shtml "Li Jie, a researcher at the Chinese Naval Research Institute, told the Global Times that Japanese military vessels and aircraft have often made provocative gestures by tailing Chinese navy vessels on the high seas.

    "If the reports from Japan are true, the Chinese navy vessels might have intended to prepare for further provocative acts from the Japanese side by testing their radar equipment," Li said.

    Chinese navy vessels are often followed and harassed by Japanese military vessels and aircraft as soon as they leave Chinese territorial waters, a military source told the Global Times earlier."

    As you can see, Japan is desperately trying to BAIT China to take the first shot AND hoodwink world opinions AND US citizens into supporting her! I hope the Obama administration DEMAND Japan navy ship logs and helicopter flight records so as to EXPOSE Japan's dirty tricks. Japan's window to entrap China is this year because China is getting stronger and Japan is very afraid of Chinese stealth ships and fighter planes coming online very fast that can easily shoot down F15 fighters trailing Chinese small propeller planes!

  • -5

    Paul Arenson

    Good guy, bad guy crap.We tend to favor our own side. Propaganda accepted without question. China does it, Japan does it, US does it. Legally, Japan may well be in the right in terms of ownership---almost all parties from the left to the right in Japan have produced documents to that effect. But, Japan has some pretty dangerous politicians around who sought to provoke China, from Ishihara on down. The US and Japan are looking for any excuse to maintain a justification for US bases and weapons, never mind that the primary purpose is for the US to maintain readiness to fight its wars. The weapons makers want this too. Japan's far right, descended from the per war imperial forces and kept in place by US occupation forces/SCAP, wants a demilitarized Japan. They also want to whitewash history textbooks ((Abe himself persuaded NHK in he early 2000s to censor a program about Hirohito's war responsibility. Ishihara is a racist; Hashimoto is a fascist wannabe. These are the forces of good versus China's Darth Vader evil?

    In short, there is no right or wrong. Territorially yes, perhaps. But do you want Japan to go to ar over these rocks, just so Abe can destroy Article 9 of the constitution and then go on trying to remake Japan into a country with even worse history books than now, propping up Keidanren and building more nukes, while US military industry is not to displeased, while civil liberties are curtailed....whether or not Japan has a valid territorial claim--and it looks like they do-using that as a justification for war does not benefit the people who live here....

    The real problems go unsolved as another capitalist, profits before people regime is emboldened by China's stupidity. Northern Territories? Same thing. The indigenous people do not benefit one way or the other whether Soviet/Russian hegemonists or Yamato land grabbers own thei land. Korea and Japan--the nationalists n both sides can scream at each other over who owns those rocks. The follies of nation states do not benefit those who live in them, who are asks to defend politicians' prnouncements with their taxes, and with their lives when the military machine calls them up to defend the homeland.

    It is all bullshit. Military refusers in Vietnam knew this. Iraq veterans know this. Bradley Manniing knows this. In Israel too there iis a solid movement of refusers and Ex soldiers. Anywhere supposedly democratic countries use the deception that the other side is communist or terrorist or whatver the current key word for enemy is.Manwhile inequality and child mortality, lack of jobs and healthcare thrive in much of the US. Meanwhile Palestinians are virtual prisoners behind "security walls". Meanwhile the US kills kids in Yemen and even legally justifies assassinations of Amecan citizens without having to prove that the targeted person is guilty of anything.

    The thread that binds all these seemingly disparate topics is that PO many of us buy into the good guy, bad guy notion, that god (or right) is on our side. We can look at the Senkaku issue and use China's stupidity as a justification for our own stupidity. We lap without question at the chance to defend our own side, just as they do. But you and I are not the beneficiaries of any benevolence fom those we rush to defend. We are pawns in their game. For the current rightist leadership of Japan, their goals are quite transparent. They are looking for any chance to ditch the pace constitution. No higher morality on the Chinese side--we are all guilty. But ask yourself why Japan, bombed twice with nuclear weapons, always votes WITH the US in opposing true denuclearization. It is because Japan is still a vassal state, a US colony. Someyimes its rightist tendencies are such that they even urk US bureaucrats, who prefer a more nuanced approach to China, for example. But it stills plays into their hands to have a pro business, pro base stance. No morality here. No reason to condem one side and not the other.

    In short,

  • 0

    Paul Arenson

    correction.. Japan's far right....wants a REmilitarised Japan. Not demilitarized.

  • 12

    KariHaruka

    smacks head against keyboard

    Holy hell China are you seriously this frigging ignorant and stupid?!

    You lock your weapons onto Japanese warships in Japanese waters and you accuse Japan of a smear campaign?

  • -19

    Tony Ew

    @Neo_RioFeb. 08, 2013 - 09:17AM JST

    The Chinese want to goad Japan into firing the first shot... ....the unfortunate thing is that, if they don't get that, nothing's stopping the Chinese from firing first and then claiming self-defence anyway. It doesn't seem unlikely given what we've heard so far. They're sticking to their own narrative.

    No, it is Japan trying to trap China to fire the first shot. I just commented here, hopefully not removed. As I said clearly, Japan have only this year to try to entrap China to make the first shot. Come end of this year, more stealth Chinese J20, J15. J31 and new destroyers type 052D to sink the Japanese ships and shoot down F15's. Japan is very very afraid! Chinese new destroyers can take on the best Japanese destroyers as well. Submarines equal match, both diesel electric, but China have nuclear sub advantage too.

    Ask yourself why China want to goad Japan to fire the first shot? Maybe only three Chinese navy ships pass through that area near Senkaku/Diaoyu Islands on the way to the Western Pacific or come back after naval exercises. WHY would Chinese ships goad Japan while transiting so near to Japanese naval base and air base with A LOT MORE FIRE POWER? Don't you think this is SUICIDAL? So please everybody, don't be hoodwinked by the Japanese government cunning tactics.

    AS USUAL, JAPAN IS VERY GOOD AT PLAYING VICTIM WHILE IN FACT IS A VERY NASTY AGGRESSOR CLOAKED AS VICTIM!

  • 11

    Elbuda Mexicano

    China is a joke! And a bad joke at that! Japan is "trying to smear the image o China??" HAHAHAHA!! They have been smearing their OWN image for many, many years now, so sorry for Beijing! Keep breathing in your filthy air, maybe that is what is happening, they are "high" on all those toxic fumes now in China.

  • 0

    Virtuoso

    No, it is Japan trying to trap China to fire the first shot.

    I can never understand the warped logic of anyone who purposely picks a fight and then blames then other side for starting it, especially when he loses. This is what some Japanese have done when they blamed Roosevelt for "forcing" them into a sneak attack at Pearl Harbor.

  • 1

    FightingViking

    @Paul Arenson

    Excellent post !

  • 7

    globalwatcher

    Beijing foreign ministry spokeswoman Hua Chunying said: “Recently Japan has been hyping up crisis and eliberately creating tension to smear China’s image

    Grow up China. It still does not justify what you have done to Japan. Again, PRC has violated a basic rule of UN and I want PRC to be removed from UN Security Concil seat.

    PRC response like this reminds me a bully making excuses to justify his behavior in front of school principal and social workers and nobody are buying it. PRC, back off.

  • -14

    Tony Ew

    @VirtuosoFeb. 08, 2013 - 09:18AM JST

    Almost anything written about China that happens to be true can probably be taken as a "smear."

    Ladies and gentlemen! There is more than meets the eye! Here is a very plausible hypothesis:

    Scholar Hu Lingyuan in China's Oriental Morning Post:
    

    "With the imminent visit to the US by Shinzo Abe, Japan must keep hyping up threats from China to strengthen its alliance with the US."

    This got nothing to do with this scholar is a Chinese guy. It's good honest analysis. As I said before, Japan is trying to TRAP China to take the First Shot, so Abe LOOKS GOOD to Obama ! Even this radar lock seems to give Japan a public relation coup. This is HIGH STAKE PUBLIC RELATIONS EXERCISE TO GOAD US TO SUPPORT JAPAN TO GO TO WAR WITH CHINA!

    OBAMA MUST DEMAND JAPAN NAVY SHIP LOGS, HELICOPTER FLIGHT RECORDS TO MAKE SURE THERE IS NO AGGRESSIVE MOVE DONE BY JAPAN ON PURPOSE FOR POLITICAL MILEAGE. Abe knows US public will not support another war, so he need to cook up something! He is playing US citizens HONOR the treaty credibility, so he is also trying to ENTRAP US too! (just like Israel Iran war danger)

    I hope the US taxpayers understand Japan practice very deceitful military and political moves as evidenced by history and thus should be very wary being sucked into this war which is far far far more costly and possibly catastrophic compared with Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, even Iran!

  • 3

    Neo_Rio

    China has a motive to grab the islands to bolster it's control of the surrounding sea. This is an issue that CHINA started. Japan has nothing to gain from a confrontation with China, but China has a strategic outpost to gain, not to mention a boost in nationalistic fervour, and to inflict damage on Japanese economic relations to promote it's own products.

    Japan can't possibly be an aggressor until they've done something aggressive, whether they choose to "play victim" or not is irrelevant. If they're being cunning, it's to outwit a state actor trying to bully them out of an island.

    Don't forget that the island was sold by the people who actually lived on it to the Japanese government. They could have sold it to China, but didn't.

  • 4

    globalwatcher

    OBAMA MUST DEMAND JAPAN NAVY SHIP LOGS, HELICOPTER FLIGHT RECORDS TO MAKE SURE THERE IS NO AGGRESSIVE MOVE DONE BY JAPAN ON PURPOSE FOR POLITICAL MILEAGE

    No log necessary as long as China stays away from Senkakus. The problem solved, next?

  • 1

    Virtuoso

    It's kind of sad to see Chinese who feel that being "patriotic" simply means reflexively regurgitating the xenophobic propaganda that is spoon-fed to them by their government from the first grade onward. I have my doubts that they really believe it themselves, but they definitely know the consequences of saying they don't believe it -- 5 years of land reclamation work at a labor camp in remote Gansu or Qinghai.

  • 1

    Neo_Rio

    The LAST thing the USA wants to to have to decide who to back in a conflict. It would rather just avoid conflict altogether.

    There's absolutely no point to Japan whipping up support for aggressiveness on China. The USA is already going to back them defensively. In fact a lot of Japanese don't even want the US military bases! Playing devil's advocate for a minute, suppose Japan was the one provoking China, the USA would slap them back pretty quickly. The USA does not want war with China. Such a war would be produce WW3.

  • 2

    tmtmsnb

    Not reported by JT but USA Japan Australia joint naval war game has just started, China has a lot of targets to aim at.

    Moderator: We have a story on it.

  • 3

    nandakandamanda

    Here is the danger: "China’s premier-in-waiting Li Keqiang, meanwhile, urged marine surveillance staff on Thursday to intensify law enforcement in China’s sea territories, according to the official Xinhua news agency." End quote.

    Since China is forming a new vision of its sea territories, based upon some ancient empire, and this 'law' to be enforced is China's alone, not international maritime law, clashes will be almost inevitable.

    In fact China is a bit like a pre-eruption volcano, ringed by frustratingly restrictive islands to the east, threatening to burst through and overwhelm any weak points. In fact conflict might even be palliative, a relief to China right now. Who they use to burst the skin is largely irrelevant, but the old enemy Japan is a convenient scapegoat.

  • 1

    globalwatcher

    The USA does not want war with China. Such a war would be produce WW3.

    You have not read the most recent comment by Obama. We are already in cyberwar against China. China is already breaking our systems of NYT, Washington Post, The Wall Street Journals, and many others. China can cripple our air traffic control, utility, government security systems as well. We are under threat China can shut down whole USA tomorrow.

  • -2

    herefornow

    Glad I am out of Japan. The thought of two childish, immature governments playing chicken with real weapons would cause me to lose too much sleep.

  • 2

    basroil

    Asked to respond to Japanese Defense Minister Itsunori Onodera’s description of the radar targeting as a “threat of force”, Beijing foreign ministry spokeswoman Hua Chunying said: “Recently Japan has been hyping up crisis and deliberately creating tension to smear China’s image.

    Interesting that they don't deny that they enabled fire-and-forget weapons systems against a foreign ship . The only thing smearing their image is their government.

  • -2

    Ewan Huzarmy

    No log necessary as long as China stays away from Senkakus. The problem solved, next?

    Anone who counters an argument with this kind of 'meh whatever' attitude, needs to have their tongue scrubbed with a shite-smeared brillo pad.

  • 1

    globalwatcher

    Ewan HuzarmyFeb. 08, 2013 - 11:22AM JST

    No log necessary as long as China stays away from Senkakus. The problem solved, next?

    Anone who counters an argument with this kind of 'meh whatever' attitude, needs to have their tongue scrubbed with a shite-smeared brillo pad.

    So what is your solution to that? It is easy to criticize, huh.

    I am very sick of being politically correct. For China, no nonsense approach is the only way. They have been getting away too much in the past.

  • -2

    Ewan Huzarmy

    ^ Blame your own government then, for selling out.

  • 3

    globalwatcher

    Ewan HuzarmyFeb. 08, 2013 - 11:34AM JST

    ^ Blame your own government then, for selling out.

    What a heck are you talking about, Ewan? Lost ship?

  • -1

    Ewan Huzarmy

    So why can't you find the middle way ...... Do you have to go from political correctness to right wing war mongering paranoia ?

  • 0

    SamuraiBlue

    basroil

    Interesting that they don't deny that they enabled fire-and-forget weapons systems against a foreign ship . The only thing smearing their image is their government.

    According to NHK they did, they denied the whole event had ever happened.

  • -1

    tian4670

    One problem on Japanese side, I believe, is that for 3 disputes, 3 totally different standards and logic in application:

    1. Northern Island - compromise with Russian

    2. Dokto Island - let ICJ decide

    3. Diaoyu Island - let alliance fight out China

    Three sets of standards invented to maximize its own benefit. None of them acceptable for the other party.

  • -5

    Ewan Huzarmy

    No, I'm talking about how the U.S is in dept to China, and have everything made at walmart from China. You can't blame the Chinese for that. This is why the U.S can only issue a few veiled threats, making Japan confident that they'll be protected by the U.S. I don't think the U.S wants anything to do with it.

    Unless there's a nefarious reason, i.e arms sales.

  • -3

    Zenpun

    Paul Arenson

    Yep! I agree with your entire post. When there was a crime sense, we have to find the valid evidence and DNA test for judging who is a criminal. Everyone has presumption of innocence.

    Sadly there are very few posters who are fair minded and balanced like you.

  • -1

    Ewan Huzarmy

    According to NHK they did, they denied the whole event had ever happened

    Yeah, and NHK is going to be completely unbiased I guess.

  • 2

    globalwatcher

    Ewan HuzarmyFeb. 08, 2013 - 11:36AM JST

    So why can't you find the middle way ...... Do you have to go from political correctness to right wing war mongering paranoia ?

    Paranoia?
    Where did you get that? In this conflict, I see China has no wins.

  • 2

    Virtuoso

    The Chinese military has not engaged in large-scale military action since the invasion of Vietnam in 1979 -- almost 35 years ago -- and it fared rather badly against Vietnamese reserve divisions, which had plenty of combat experience. Imagine how humiliated it would look if China's untested navy locks horns with Japan in a naval and air engagement and gets soundly thrashed. (Or if it even ends in a stalemate when the US threatens to intervene.) What's it going to do then? Nuke Tokyo?

  • 1

    globalwatcher

    tmtmsnbFeb. 08, 2013 - 11:07AM JST

    Not reported by JT but USA Japan Australia joint naval war game has just started, China has a lot of targets to aim at.

    Moderator: We have a story on it.

    Many friends have already left here for this many months ago.

  • -4

    ctskelly

    When my little sister and I fought over something, my mom and dad would say, "Stop fighting. Share it 50-50. And be friends." Seems even more reasonable now. (but what about Taiwan...")

  • 0

    hidingout

    I believe China completely.

    You would ...

    Neighboring nations will not tolerate Japan trying to expand as it did during its Imperial days.

    As soon as there's any indication that Japan is trying to do that you might have a point. Until then, its pretty clear that all the expansionist dreams are in the minds of the communists.

  • -10

    FPSRussia

    @Virtuoso. Yes, nuke Tokyo. Do you think China will allow it's lands to be occupied by Japanese forces ever again?

    What are hoping for? A classic war? Go play Stratego if you're that bored.

    Yes, what we can expect is a nuclear war. China clearly knows that cutting the head odd the chicken solves the problem. Why not follow in America's footsteps?

    They will not land troops? It's not a ground invasion, so what it's gonna be? They launch their birds and Japan launches it's. oh wait a minute....you don't have any birds. If that's true, then nuclear war is winnable.

    Just one nuke on Tokyo and the war is over. Everybody knows that.

  • 2

    Virtuoso

    The Chinese have developed Marxist dialectic materialism to a fine art. Their standard argument goes, "You absolutely cannot be right because we cannot possibly be wrong. There is no room for any middle ground. And in the event of any confusion or misunderstanding, please refer to the previous two sentences."

  • 4

    Sentiments

    Seems China wants to step up the rhetorics by smearing Japan for lying. As far as I have seen it is only China that distributes lies and home-made stories so far. Brace yourself for another campaign of pro-china propaganda.

  • 4

    cabadaje

    @tian4670

    One problem on Japanese side, I believe, is that for 3 disputes, 3 totally different standards and logic in application:

    This shouldn't be a surprise. It is common sense. Three different cultures, three different relationships, three different histories, three different economic ties...

    How could there possibly be any one single standard that could cover all of them?

    Three sets of standards invented to maximize its own benefit.

    Well...yes. Again, common sense. Who isn't trying to get as much as they can out of a deal?

    As long as you aren't breaching international law, you can set up whatever conditions you like. How you deal with the consequences to your reputation is another matter entirely.

    None of them acceptable for the other party.

    Situation normal for any negotiation. That's what the negotiation is for. If everything was acceptable, there wouldn't be a dispute to begin with, let alone a negotiation.

  • -11

    Tony Ew

    @Neo_RioFeb. 08, 2013 - 11:00AM JST

    The LAST thing the USA wants to to have to decide who to back in a conflict. It would rather just avoid conflict altogether.

    There's absolutely no point to Japan whipping up support for aggressiveness on China. The USA is already going to back them defensively. In fact a lot of Japanese don't even want the US military bases! Playing devil's advocate for a minute, suppose Japan was the one provoking China, the USA would slap them back pretty quickly. The USA does not want war with China. Such a war would be produce WW3.

    First Obama should demand to learn Japanese navy and helicopter movement patterns against Chinese ships. Yes, I think if Obama is bright enough he will just serve sushi to Abe and show him the door! I seriously suspect Abe is learning Netanyahu playbook tying to entrap US into a war with China .... reluctantly. Precisely because Japan knows US have to HONOR the Security Treaty with Japan, Japan try to make US LOOKS BAD for NOT acting. For this reason US is backed against the wall AND HAVE TO ACT to save her own credibility!

    One never knows who is behind Japanese aggressive behaviour if it is proven to be true. BUT I can tell you Ishihara WANTS WAR WITH CHINA! Abe LDP is nationalist just like Ishihara, so some politics may cause Japan to become more aggressive. It is up to Obama to get to the bottom of this matter.

    America make a very big mistake saying Senkaku/Diaoyu Islands is covered by the treaty. It should be ambiguous like taking no position on sovereignty! THAT will discourage Japanese adventurism!

    So Japan is trying to entrap China AND also entrap US to go into war, IF only a short war hoping to get China off her back. Fat chance! This might snowball into a nuclear holocaust!

    Again from history books Japan war pattern, Japan have mastered the Playbook of Deception. People should not be so naive!

  • 7

    cabadaje

    @ctskelly

    When my little sister and I fought over something, my mom and dad would say, "Stop fighting. Share it 50-50. And be friends." Seems even more reasonable now. (but what about Taiwan...")

    This is what people are talking about when they say that China is trying to set a new balance. In other words, China upsets the previous balance, and then demands that the new one be set as the standard.

    So, say you and your sister each has a cookie. She eats her cookie, and then demands yours. You refuse, and a tussle breaks out. Your mom steps in and restores the balance by giving everyone half. You are out half a cookie, and if you complain, your sister accuses you of not wanting to share.

  • 7

    Alejandro Dela Cruz

    Tony Ew, you are obviously a 50 cent army.

    Anyway, again China raises the tension by a notch. Everything they do are totally opposite to what they say. Arrogance can make men blind. Keep digging up your graves China.

    China is the only country in the world where controlling information is a-must. Internet and everything, even their history are made up by their own government. And the Chinese people just allow these things to happen, shame.... They think they are too rich to buy a country by money, too bad for you China, everyone who offers money always end up being used. Oh well....

    And they really have to hire internet-comment'er-army. That's just funny.

  • 11

    cabadaje

    @FPSRussia

    Yes, nuke Tokyo.

    And this is why no one trusts China. Because it is entirely possible that they think in just that manner.

    Do you think China will allow it's lands to be occupied by Japanese forces ever again?

    Why would Japan occupy China? What advantage would it give to Japan to occupy Chinese territory that would even begin to break even with the massive disadvantages it would create?

    China is doing quite a good job smearing its own reputation through its actions. These sorts of comments are really nothing more than icing on the cake.

    Yes, what we can expect is a nuclear war. China clearly knows that cutting the head odd the chicken solves the problem. Why not follow in America's footsteps?

    Ahh, you mean like the time the US didn't use an atomic attack at the start of a war, and didn't target the head of the country, about 70 years ago, a decision which has had such an impact on the US that even in the event of a nuclear attack, nuclear retaliation is not a primary option?

    Again, if China truly does think this way, war is inevitable.

    They will not land troops? It's not a ground invasion, so what it's gonna be?

    A blockade.

    They launch their birds and Japan launches it's. oh wait a minute....you don't have any birds. If that's true, then nuclear war is winnable.

    You sound positively gleeful.

    Regardless, nukes don't stop nukes. The rest of the world figured that out a long time ago. That's why we created things that do actually stop nukes in mid-flight.

    Just one nuke on Tokyo and the war is over. Everybody knows that.

    Possibly the most inane comment yet made. If China's global perspective is such that it believes nuking a first-world metropolis would make it the king of the hill, it has no place in the global community. China's existence as a political entity would disappear within 24 hours, and the country would be under new management shortly thereafter, without a single nuke being fired, and probably with little to no Japanese involvement.

  • 1

    tmtmsnb

    ctskellyFEB. 08, 2013 - 12:25PM JST When my little sister and I fought over something, my mom and dad would say, "Stop fighting. Share it 50-50. And be friends." Seems even more reasonable now. (but what about Taiwan...")

    When I go to your house and begin to fight with you, your parents say stop fighting, share 50 50, and be good friends. I say ok but how about my brother.

    • Moderator

      Stay on topic please.

  • 6

    Probie

    Just one nuke on Tokyo and the war is over. Everybody knows that.

    Get back to eating crayons.

  • 9

    JaneM

    Tony Ew

    Your comments are truly amusing. You seem to repeat expressions you have read somewhere, slogans possibly used to educate Chinese people about the innocence and supremacy of their country and government and love to make up stories which sound more like Cold War novels than anything else. For all your accusations of Japan, it is perfectly clear that you know nothing about modern Japan, its people and their love for peace, comfort and unspoiled nature (and these are just a few of the words you can use to describe the positive mindset of the Japanese as a whole.) So before you continue to accuse this nation and their government of plotting and goading, etc., you might do well to study a little more ( but in your case it may be necessary to study a lot more) about this country which you so adamantly claim has not changed for 70 years.

  • 2

    globalwatcher

    The whole message from Beijing is that PRC has no balls to admit their wrong doings, and they never will.

  • 0

    Kazuaki Shimazaki

    Li Jie, a researcher at the Chinese Naval Research Institute, told the Global Times that Japanese military vessels and aircraft have often made provocative gestures by tailing Chinese navy vessels on the high seas.

    It is certainly true that as part of intelligence gathering, Japanese military vessels and planes do track Chinese and Russian vessels. Whether it is provocative is a matter of perspective, but objective a 3km spacing is not threatening in the high seas and it is certainly not enough to warrant a fire control radar.

    But I'll grant you the point that Japan's refusal to release track data does leave room for doubt that the Japanese ship did well ... something. I disagree that they need to release all the data, but if they want to press a claim that China used fire control radar, the tracks of the ships and helicopters near the incident area really should have been provided.

  • 3

    CGB Spender

    Demashita! It was only a matter of waiting until we hear from China another shady move in their dirty game. It's always entertaining again seeing the CPC spokeswoman on TV reiterating - overly convinced of herself - how the islands belong to China. Of course she's brainwashed like the rest of the CPC cronies. Repeat saying something over and over again until you finally believe it.

  • 5

    notlateja

    @Atheletes The type radar used was: Fire Control Radar. It is used for targetting other ships/aircraft in preparation to firing guns or ship/ship/air missiles. It is not for open ocean navigation or to avoid collisions. Please study up a little bit before commenting on something you don't truly understand. One more thing, China is well aware of the constraints Japan's Maritime Self Defense operates under. They would not have done that to a British/USA/Australian/Russian frigate or destroyer without someone firing automatically. In a situation like that, milliseconds count. A good analogy to that situation is this: I point a gun at you, pull back the hammer and put my finger on the trigger. If you had a loaded gun...what would you do? Wait for me to pull the trigger?

    @FPSRussia

    My aren't you the blood thirsty misinformed fanatic. China has a right to "paint" any ship with fire control radar? Sure. Try that with a another navies ship and there would be a different story in the news. See above.

    As for your comment "I believe China completely." Did you even look at China's spokesperson when she spoke/answered the question posed to her? Watch her eyes and face. She was lying. She knew she was lying. She didn't believe what she was saying either...nor did anyone with a shred of intelligence. She never even denied that their navy turned their fire control radar onto a Japanese SDF ship. Doesn't that say somethng to you?

    I personally don't care who controls or who owns those chunks of lifeless rock. But if there is a dispute, and there apparently is, let it be settled in the World Court. Oh...that's right....China doesn't want to have it adjudicated. They say they're right and that's it. Discussion is over, no matter what anyone else says. That sounds exactly like a stubborn child to me. Japan on the other hand is more than willing to take it to the World Court. So...who's unsure of their position? Answer: China

  • 6

    nandakandamanda

    China can accuse Japan of whatever she likes, but certain incontrovertible facts remain.

    These basic facts are:

    a) Japan has not been in an expansionist phase for nearly 70 years. She has been in a pacifist, some would say inert state, allowing herself to be pushed around and bullied by other powers nearby. Any wrong-footedness or squeak of right-wing expression is instantly jumped upon. Japan is not 'smearing' China so much as collecting evidence in front of the world for what may come when she is pushed to finally wake up and make a stand.

    b) Looked at either economically or militarily, China is at present in an overtly expansionist phase.

    One is trying to re-establish control along the dotted lines of a forgotten Qing empire, ie expanding, and one wishes to give way no further.

  • 0

    nandakandamanda

    Qing, well, maybe Ming Dynasty before that. A dotted line along a trade route?

  • -9

    Tiger_In_The_Hermitage

    I think the move really is aimed at forcing the Americans to side either with china or japan. The topic has actually been blown out of proportion as is the nuclear testing and rocket testing by North Korea, nearly all news papers and tv new is talking about NK's tests. These test do not pose any threat to Japan, NK don't even have enough to eat let alone start a war.

  • 4

    888naff

    "China accuses Japan of smear campaign over radar incident"

    FUNNY, IRONIC

    Hasn't China being conducting organized large scale smear campaign against Japan for the last half century at least.

  • -5

    Nathaw

    notlatejaFeb. 08, 2013 - 02:35PM JST

    One more thing, China is well aware of the constraints Japan's Maritime Self Defense operates under. They would not have done that to a British/USA/Australian/Russian frigate or destroyer without someone firing automatically.

    IT TAKES TWO TO DANCE TANGO! If that information comes from US surveillance ship, it has more credibility. If every frigate or destroyer of any nation will shot automatically, there will be no freedom of navigation or trade route anymore. South China sea has become a Wild West or Pirates play ground. Therefore we appreciate that Japan and PRC are not trigger happy nations.

  • 4

    globalwatcher

    IT TAKES TWO TO DANCE TANGO!

    Do not let this old myth to fool you. In reality, one can start troubles without the other. You know it. The myth has been proven as a fault in the court over and over.

  • -6

    tian4670

    @nandakandamanda

    An even more inconvenient fact is that China is more peaceful than American according to some standards.

    An American institution concluded last year after some studies that, despite a series of hardware upgrade recently, Chinese army is still far behind American. Because Chinese army hasn't fought any war in last decades, while American has a non-stop line of war. Hence American officials have real life experience across all level, while Chinese officials have zero.

  • -6

    Tiger_In_The_Hermitage

    I think there is news now that China did not lock radar and its just a thing that was made up by our government.... whatever the case maybe, I hope a war does not break out.

  • 2

    globalwatcher

    TigerInThe_HermitageFeb. 08, 2013 - 06:21PM JST

    I think there is news now that China did not lock radar and its just a thing that was made up by our government.... whatever the case maybe, I hope a war does not break out.

    China is starting to believe their own lies. Don't they know everything is now in hitech and can be easily traced? I am sure they will do the same to the States. Pathetic.

  • 0

    technosphere

    The type radar used was: Fire Control Radar. It is used for targetting other ships/aircraft in preparation to firing guns or ship/ship/air missiles. It is not for open ocean navigation or to avoid collisions. Please study up a little bit before commenting on something you don't truly understand. One more thing, China is well aware of the constraints Japan's Maritime Self Defense operates under. They would not have done that to a British/USA/Australian/Russian frigate or destroyer without someone firing automatically. In a situation like that, milliseconds count. A good analogy to that situation is this: I point a gun at you, pull back the hammer and put my finger on the trigger. If you had a loaded gun...what would you do? Wait for me to pull the trigger?

    An excellent post !

  • 4

    JaneM

    I think Japan or US are more desperate about feeding their people, employing hopeless and long term unemployment army and balancing their respective account. If there was a competency assessment, both of them failed. PRC is not chronic patient. more likely acute patient. No wonder Panetta is reluctant to touch with PRC.

    If you call the total lack of care for its people, then the Chinese government is one of the most competent in the world. Harassment, no freedom of speech or expression, a huge social gap between the eastern coast and the inland areas -these and many other things certainly show that the Chinese government is very competent - in maintaining power at any cost, including the cost of human life.

  • 3

    Tamarama

    The pro-Chinese posters here mirror the general timbre of the state media generated self image China has of itself - namely that it is a virtuous country finally taking it's place at the top echelons of humanity, where it rightfully belongs and where it will begin to stamp it's authority on the rest of the world.

    This has very strong echoes of the past, when rapid economic prosperity combined with nationalist fervour to send countries on a collision course with disaster. Japan did it, Germany did it. I am generally of the opinion, given the way China is starting to behave, that they are going to be the next to do so and it will all end in tears.

    It seems sadly inevitable right now.

    Composed with the help of Stella Artois.

  • -3

    Zenpun

    Tamarama

    Everyone has freedom of right s to express their opinions. If all posts are one sided lt is no longer discussion forum.It has become a propaganda warfare. It will be pretty boring for seeing all identical posts. It will end in tears has happened in Middle East. Asians needs to be calm down the tension. Not inflaming with hatred propaganda.

  • 1

    KariHaruka

    Just one nuke on Tokyo and the war is over. Everybody knows that.

    Just 1 nuclear attack on Tokyo from China and China will face consequences from UN nations. By this I mean they will face military action.

  • 3

    Tamarama

    Zenpun

    Everyone has freedom of right s to express their opinions.

    That's true, and thank you. I certainly feel comfortable expressing mine.

    Asians needs to be calm down the tension. Not inflaming with hatred propaganda.

    That would be the sensible thing to do. But I don't see China headed down that path - their words and deeds are not reflective of a country with peace as it's primary objective. I think they want to see how strong they really are. There's your tears, baby.

  • 5

    Hansaram

    “Recently Japan has been hyping up crisis and deliberately creating tension to smear China’s image.

    If you don't want Japan or anyone else smear you, just behave yourself.

  • -5

    Zenpun

    Tamarama

    Sorry I have no tears anymore due to mining dust exposure. Sound like do not cry for me China instead of Argentina. You have to remember PRC have victims mentality. However Japan is not different too. Japan also likes a baby crying for milk.

    Pot and Kettle can boil the water in different form. Rest of Asians do not like extreme form of evaporation of boiling water. Therefore rest of Asians have to calm two grown up kids for not becoming extreme.

  • 2

    JoeBigs

    The only smearing going on here is what the PRC is doing to the truth.

    The PRC is the greatest threat to world peace.

  • -8

    Tony Ew

    @Kazuaki ShimazakiFeb. 08, 2013 - 02:17PM JST

    Li Jie, a researcher at the Chinese Naval Research Institute, told the Global Times that Japanese military vessels and aircraft have often made provocative gestures by tailing Chinese navy vessels on the high seas.

    It is certainly true that as part of intelligence gathering, Japanese military vessels and planes do track Chinese and Russian vessels. Whether it is provocative is a matter of perspective, but objective a 3km spacing is not threatening in the high seas and it is certainly not enough to warrant a fire control radar.

    But I'll grant you the point that Japan's refusal to release track data does leave room for doubt that the Japanese ship did well ... something. I disagree that they need to release all the data, but if they want to press a claim that China used fire control radar, the tracks of the ships and helicopters near the incident area really should have been provided.

    I see you are one of the more sober fair minded poster here, especially from a Japanese person. Thank you.

    I take exception to the 3 km distance as not threatening. This is NOT old time slow motion warfare. 3 km = under 9 SECOND from being hit by a missile from the other ship! THIS MODERN WARFARE IS SO DANGEROUS DISTANCE CANNOT BE EQUATED AS 'SAFE' IN TRADITIONAL SENSE. THAT IS WHY SOME ANTI SHIP MISSILES ARE ALSO LIMITED IN RANGE TO REDUCE THEIR LETHALITY IN INTERNATIONALLY AGREED PROTOCOL. ( I believe I read that somewhere Russian Indian Brahmos missile range limit)

  • -1

    Ewan Huzarmy

    it is perfectly clear that you know nothing about modern Japan, its people and their love for peace, comfort and unspoiled nature

    JaneM from your comment above, it's obvious that you don't live in Japan. What with right-wing war mongerers determined to change the constitution and the same party (LDP) wanting to concrete over everything willy-nilly. Oh, and who voted these idiots into power, that's right, the peace-and-nature-loving Japanese public.

    • Moderator

      Readers, please keep the discussion civil.

  • 2

    Tamarama

    Zenpun,

    Sorry I have no tears anymore due to mining dust exposure.

    The tears will be those of China mostly and the other countries who will get drawn into a conflict with China.

    Therefore rest of Asians have to calm two grown up kids for not becoming extreme.

    The problem with this statement is that China, as a burgeoning nationalist superpower are starting to look very much like some of the countries I mentioned before who believe they are far superior to their neighbours, and therefore will reject their efforts to mollify China's aggression and expansionist mentality.

  • -3

    Spidey

    "Did not." "Did to."

    "Did not!" "Did to!"

    "You're a stinky face!" "No. YOU'RE a stinky face!!"

    Need I say more?

    S

  • 1

    overchan

    Luckly Someone is believing china in USA. (chinatown citizens).

  • 1

    T-Mack

    Who is China really testing here? Japan?, or the United States of America? China know's the US will be drawn into the conflict if the glove's come off....Japanese Navy need's to be on Guard...!!! eye for an eye, ping for a ping or Fight or Flight?

  • 1

    A Realist

    China feels it can do anything it likes, but if they do something wrong and you point it out then you are "smearing China" or "tarnishing China's reputation." Lol, what reputation? How can you tarnish something that is as black as coal.

  • 0

    Shuami

    if they do something wrong and you point it out then you are "smearing China" or "tarnishing China's reputation.

    If you accuse somebody of doing something bad but can't produce evidence to support your accusation, what do you call that if it is NOT "smearing"?!

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