Hatoyama finalizing plan to break deadlock over Futenma relocation

Saturday 21st November, 06:16 AM JST

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15 Comments

the_sicilian at 09:10 AM JST - 21st November

This ought to be interesting. And extreme suffering is not a valid expression. Ask the hundreds of land owners who receive money, and the j-gov subsidies tied to the base.

I agree, it needs to be moved or gone, but there is no extreme suffering.
perspective at 11:58 AM JST - 21st November

I think it's funny that they are talking about setting "conditions" for going along with an agreement they already negotiated in good faith.

Extreme suffering probably means when the aircraft noise interferes with watching one of the many lame TV shows on the tube.
sharky1 at 02:17 PM JST - 21st November

There is no deadlock...there is an agreement...either they honor the agreement, or Japan can be known as a nation that can't be trusted by any other nation.
Kapuna at 02:29 PM JST - 21st November

What will happen, most likely, is the airfield will be relocated. After it has been completed and, before it is put to use, negotiations will commence to relocate it.
bam_boo at 03:35 PM JST - 21st November

perspective,

Extreme suffering probably means when the aircraft noise interferes with watching one of the many lame TV shows on the tube.

what a cynical comment... and a slap in the face of the Okinawan people concerned.

Did you hear of the US military helicopter crashing into the 'Okinawa University' right beside the Futenma base in 2004, perspective? It seemed like a miracle no one in the university was hurt, even there were people in the building the helicopter went into.

After the crash US military personal sealed the crash site and didn't even let local police enter. The only local that could enter was the pizza service delivery boy delivering pizza to the US military police on site. Imagine this happening the US?!

A foreign power barring US police from entering an accident site inside the US! Being so week and helpless inside your own country would create a trauma for americans.

This is reality in Okinawa and this is what is also meant by extreme suffering, not only the noise of the bases and the fear of an helicopter crashing into your backyard, or into the university where your kids are studying.

I think it's funny that they are talking about setting "conditions" for going along with an agreement they already negotiated in good faith.

since there was a landslide change in Japan's political landscape conditions have changed, perspective. It's a pity though that Hatoyama seems to think that the US is in the more powerful position.

'negotiated in good faith'? Either you don't know or don't want to know the complete story of the negotiations. The whole relocation agreement was a dishonest power-game in which the weakest position was that of the Okinawans.

Hatoyama is the first Japanese prime minister who empathizes with the Okinawan people and I wish him the guts to also concretely improve the situation for Okinawans.
lincolnman at 04:07 PM JST - 21st November

Everyone here but Bam boo has it right. Hatoyama dithered for pure poltical posturing (maybe Ozawa told him too). But he finally realized that once a government puts it's signature to a bilateral agreement - they're honored to carry it out. Now the US has to agree to some more smal concessions, so that Hatoyama doesn't lose too much face. Its interesting, but isn't that a tactic taken out of the North Korean negotiation playbook? Sign an agreement, then backout, and then agree to re-implement the agreement with more concessions?

I just don't see how some folks think this agreement doesn't do anything to reduce the large US military presence on Okinawa - Futenma gets moved to CP Schwab in a remote area of Nago, and the land returned to Japan. Camp Kinser, Naha Port, and portions of Camps Butler and Foster are also returned to the GOJ and 8,000 Marines move to Guam. Is it perfect, no, is it a significant improvement, no doubt.

My personal opinion only from living on Okinawa for three years, but I found the politicians, the academics and the media are virulently anti-US military. The average local Okinawan is sensible and smart enough to know that moving large portions of the US military out of Okinawa would give a major shock to the economy and jobs - the US military is the second largest employer on Okinawa, after the Prefectural government. Some of the Japanese security guards at our bases were 4 year graduates of Ryuku University - they couldn't find any other work. They were and are superb employees - I was glad we had them, but felt sorry for them nonetheless.
perspective at 05:51 PM JST - 21st November

**

**A foreign power barring US police from entering an accident site inside the US! Being so week and helpless inside your own country would create a trauma for americans. This is reality in Okinawa and this is what is also meant by extreme suffering, not only the noise of the bases and the fear of an helicopter crashing into your backyard, or into the university where your kids are studying.

Your post is just hyperbole. You take one or two incidents of accidents and blow it up into suffering of an entire population. The part about only letting the pizza boy in - oh, the horror...

Am I cynical? Sure I am. You tell me exactly what conditions have changed? Just the ruling party - one that came to power by making a lot of promises that they aren't going to be able to keep. All this crap in the news about renegotiating is just posturing by Hatoyama to distinguish himself in public opinion from the previous prime minister and to distract the Japanese public from focusing on just how screwed up things are about to become in this country.

BTW, the people around Atsugi and the other air bases in mainland Japan also complain about the noise but they don't seem to characterize it as extreme suffering.
sharky1 at 07:21 PM JST - 21st November

As long as the Japanese government argues over a signed agreement, the longer Futenma will conduct business as usual. This whole thing could be a smoke screen by Hatoyama to keep the bases where they are, while looking like a hero to the anti US Military extremists.
NuckinFutz at 09:19 PM JST - 21st November

Extreme suffering my a$$! For 60 years the Japanese have been building up AROUND the US installations and now they complain that the bases are in the middle of thier cities and presenting a danger! Can anybody show me pictures if US troops holding guns to the heads of Japanese construction companies and forcing them to build apartments and universities right next to the friggin fence? Hey, I think I'll build my house right at the end of this runway so in a few decades I can whine about the noise and get paid to shut up by my own government! Maybe I'll buy 1 tsubo of land just inside the fence of Kadena AB so I can protest how my valuable farmland is being occupied and wasted!

If the US military leaves Okinawa you'll see EXTREME POVERTY! It's already the poorest prefecture in Japan. Take away one of the biggest EMPLOYERS of JAPANESE and you'll have just another island with it's beautiful concrete lined shores, construction chemical dead coral reefs, overfished waters, endless convenience stores, overpriced hotels, and not much the any foreign tourist would want to see.

I'm sure the Chinese could do something nice with it though ...
Sarge at 09:28 PM JST - 21st November

Nuckin - I suggest kicking the royals out of the Imperial Palace and moving the whiners there, but downtown Tokyo is noisier than around Futenma, and it would become even noisier with the whiners there, so I guess that's a no-go.
sbg711 at 09:45 PM JST - 21st November

I'll concur to bam_boo. To begin with, no one gave U.S. the right to judge and control foreign country affairs. (nor has any other country had/will ever have the right to do so) Japan has its own people, its own traditions, its own beliefs and is to decide its own future without having to obey to some industrial or economical giant. China already told U.S. to get lost, so why won't Japan do the same and speak up for itself for once?
bam_boo at 02:31 AM JST - 22nd November

perspective,

BTW, the people around Atsugi and the other air bases in mainland Japan also complain about the noise but they don't seem to characterize it as extreme suffering.

if you're not able to understand the difference between the situation in mainland Japan and Okinawa you won't be able to contribute anything meaningful to this discussion.

I suggest you do some basic reading on the topic:

http://www.niraikanai.wwma.net/pages/contemporary_okinawa.html

a great collection of articles and links on the current situation and its background

http://www.japanfocus.org/-Gavan-McCormack/2275

http://www.japanfocus.org/-StudyGrouponOkinawanExternal_Affairs-/3254

Extreme suffering my a$$! For 60 years the Japanese have been building up AROUND the US installations and now they complain that the bases are in the middle of thier cities and presenting a danger!

NuckinFutz, trying to turn reality upside down? We're talking about Okinawa, home to Okinawans. No Okinawan asked you to occupy 20% of the main island and put US installations there.

Besides you very much sound like a colonial slavedriver complaining about these silly aborigines not knowing how to cherish the achievements of superior white civilization that god-bless-america brought them.

If the US military leaves Okinawa you'll see EXTREME POVERTY! It's already the poorest prefecture in Japan.

You might have not noticed from your fenced perspective that by now the US bases create more of a threat to the Okinawan economy then a benefit. Currently US military related business accounts for less then 5% of the Okinawan economy, but it poses a menace for the tourism industry which is now by far the most important business in Okinawa.
cliffworks at 12:02 PM JST - 22nd November

I've been in Japan nearly 40 years, speak nihongo fluently, go to Okinawa monthly do lots of research; all the Uchinanchu's I've met from high school students to business leaders don't have fond feelings for mainland Japanese at all, they correctly view them as conceited, pushy, cold. It's commonly known mainlanders look down on the Ryukyu folks they dominated. Sure there are some US military jerks and no one likes them anywhere, but there are also plenty of decent, educated, caring military personnel and dependents too.

I'm for incresing US military presence all over Japan, give me a base on every block. Would like to ensure all are educated in the language and some customs of ther host country though, some but not all as many customs are outdated and pointless in this modern world.
the_sicilian at 01:27 PM JST - 22nd November

Nice cliff.....Wait for the hate filled response, and good to point out what the locals really think of mainlanders. Very true.
perspective at 05:49 PM JST - 22nd November

**

if you're not able to understand the difference between the situation in mainland Japan and Okinawa you won't be able to contribute anything meaningful to this discussion.

Because I disagree with your position, now I don't understand and can't make a "meaningful contribution" to this thread. You sound like members of a certain political party in the US, they say much the same thing - disagree with us and you're pretty much a cretin.

I understand fully well that the Okinawan peoples' wrath should be directed towards their government in Tokyo. Don't like what the government is doing? Strive for independence and then you can get rid of all bases in Okinawa. Too radical a solution? Travel to Tokyo with friends and like minded people and march in front of the Diet everyday until you get what you want. Think that's going to happen? Doh!! No!! Because you already know that the Japanese government is not going to move those bases - it will cost entirely too much in terms of money and politics. This house of cards has existed for 60 years and will continue to exist because the Japanese government sees it as the lesser of evils compared to the alternative of remilitarizing and the consequences of that course of action.

Might be more productive to you to explain to Hatoyama the gospel according to BamBoo and tell him he doesn't understand. Better do it quickly though, something tells me he's gonna have much bigger fish to fry very soon.