Microsoft retools Office for touch screen, web use

The requested article has expired, and is no longer available. Any related articles, and user comments are shown below.

  • 0

    BertieWooster

    MS Word was good up to Version 5.1.

    Since then, generations of committees have added their ideas to create the complicated, bloated behemoth that it is today. It's ghastly.

    $100 a year for that?

    No thank you.

  • 0

    Speed

    That's expensive.

  • 1

    zichi

    I already have Office 2013 on my Windows 7 which I can also access via my iPad so available everywhere already.

  • 1

    zichi

    With the likes of CloudOn on my iPad I can already use Word, Excel, Power Point and store the finished work on my free 25GB of SkyDrive.

  • 1

    Matthew Simon

    Or just download Open Office freeware and you can do all of the thing MS Office can do for free

  • -5

    basroil

    BertieWoosterJan. 30, 2013 - 08:39AM JST

    MS Word was good up to Version 5.1.

    Since then, generations of committees have added their ideas to create the complicated, bloated behemoth that it is today. It's ghastly.

    That's entirely incorrect. Word 2010 was the first one to actually be worth the price, a ton of features that just aren't found in any other WYSIWYG processor. Most people have no need for anything other than WordPad that comes in windows for free, but for people who actually need a processor, 2010 and 2013 are just much better.

    SpeedJan. 30, 2013 - 09:49AM JST

    That's expensive.

    $100 a year for 5 computers, with $20 in skype credit and $30 worth in online storage. That's dirt cheap any way you try to slice it.

    Matthew SimonJan. 30, 2013 - 11:35AM JST

    Or just download Open Office freeware and you can do all of the thing MS Office can do for free

    I "use" OpenOffice on one of my computers, and it is absolute and utter garbage. Spreadsheets can't make graphs that work, the document files have little useability features like styles and referencing, and absolutely no office integration (really should be called "open set of productivity-like software"). I would rather format text in HTML than use OpenOffice for anything important.

  • -1

    Aizo Yurei

    This is how it will go:

    Microsoft will finally make Office available as an app suite for Windows tablets > Windows tablets' sales will be meh at best > they finally give in and make the suite available to iOS. > Windows makes mountains of money and drops out of the hardware game. (like Sega)

  • 1

    lostrune2

    Yeah, Office programs are available as web apps with limitations. With those, ya don't even need Office installed in the computer.

    Don't like that all "disc" versions of Office are now 1-PC only, and the only way to get multiple PCs is thru 365 yearly subscription (home up to 5 PCs/tablets/smartphones). (Actually, there's no more discs: you'd have to download it --unless it's already preloaded into the PC with Windows, as expected from most manufacturers-- but you'd still need internet access to create a MS account and activate it, similar to activating an iPhone, iPod, iPad, etc. creating an Apple ID account. The MS account works the same way, allows you to save projects in the cloud account and access 'em anywhere ya can access the account or collaborate with other people, whether or not Office is installed.)

  • -4

    basroil

    Aizo YureiJan. 30, 2013 - 12:15PM JST

    Microsoft will finally make Office available as an app suite for Windows tablets

    RT already had that.

    Windows tablets' sales will be meh at best

    Estimated 1 million for RT, Win8Pro will probably be in the 10 million range in first 6 mo, 10 million a month a year later.

    they finally give in and make the suite available to iOS.

    Not going to happen while Apple holds the keys.

    Windows makes mountains of money and drops out of the hardware game.

    People have been saying that since the XBox was good but not great. Then they came out with the 360 and people weren't saying that any more.

  • 3

    zichi

    250,000 Surface RT sold? Very small numbers.

  • 3

    timtak

    Bertie is always right.

    2010/2013 have "a ton of features that just aren't found in any other WYSIWYG processor." What?

    I am not sure what they are. Powerpoint in 2010/2013 lost the ability to record macros. That is just sinful. I had (students get the newer version and send me files that I can't quite open) to purchase the new versions, which actually do less!

    PowerPoint now shows me font size changes in real time, and in 2013 it tells me when photos are alighted with the edges or centers of adjacent photos. I am not aware of any improvements for me in Word or Excel, on a variety of annoyances.

    I was happy with Word 2000. I hate searching around 2010/2013 ribbons for one thing. Gosh they make me annoyed. E.g. finding the insert table of contents (in the reference not the insert ribbon) or insert cross reference (in the insert rather than the reference ribbon).

    There was enough real estate to put all the comands I used on the "home" (or only) ribbon in 2000. In 2010/2013 I only get to configure the quick access toolbar which is not big enough for the buttons I want. I can't even configure it use drag and drop as was possible in 2000.

    I don't want to be able to touch my screen. I want to keep my fingers on my keyboard for as much time as possible. My screen (large and upright) is more than an arms distance away.

  • 0

    BertieWooster

    Zichi,

    250,000 Surface RT sold? Very small numbers.

    MS has never done well with hardware.

    That watch thingy, Zune, tablets, that horrible little phone thing that looked like a pager and that died in a couple of weeks. XBox cost them a packet to produce and I'm not sure if they are making a profit even yet. Oh, and their keyboards are as cluttered as Word.

    Their mice (mouses?) are not bad though.

    And I certainly wouldn't want to pay a subscription plan for software.

  • 2

    zichi

    @BertieWooster

    the Surface RT & Pro will be a double whammy.

  • 1

    Scrote

    Why don't they put the ribbon along the left or right side of the window? Much of the vertical space is taken up by the ribbon and other bars, whereas the side is empty space. Also, most screens are wider than they are tall.

    Still, OpenOffice spreadsheets work fine for me. No need to worry about licenses, activation or any other nonsense. For presentations and documents Latex beats the pants off anything else. For graphs, don't use Excel: the plots look completely amateurish. Specialised graphing software does a far better job.

  • 0

    BertieWooster

    Basroil,

    On Windows you may be right about Word 2010. I dumped Windows years ago. I should have mentioned that I was referring to Office on the Mac. Up to Version 5.1, MS Word was my main word processor. It loaded fast, didn't take up much room and was fairly easy to use and stable.

    I bought and installed version 6 and soon wished I hadn't. The only way you could avoid losing data was to hit "Save" every couple of words.

    Then the committees got busy and they started adding bells and whistles in earnest. This didn't help the stability.

    In recent years, stability has stopped being an issue and I can use Word without taking medication for high blood pressure. But, in my opinion, it is far too complicated and cluttered.

    These are what I think, Basroil-san. They may differ from your ideas as we probably have different uses for word processors.

    Let's agree to differ, shall we?

  • -3

    basroil

    timtakJan. 30, 2013 - 01:18PM JST

    Bertie is always right.

    We all know he isn't

    have "a ton of features that just aren't found in any other WYSIWYG processor." What?

    If you don't know what a WYSIWYG processor is, there's always wiki. Word has plenty of features that only Latex can surpass, and plenty of features Latex doesn't offer.

    Powerpoint in 2010/2013 lost the ability to record macros. That is just sinful.

    You can record macros all you want, you just need to enable it. Disabled by default because they are horrible for system security.

    I had (students get the newer version and send me files that I can't quite open) to purchase the new versions,

    That's your fault for not suggesting compatibility presets. Just have them save as 2007, or even 98, I've NEVER had an issue with that. Notice that this happens with ANY program, not just Office, but at least office gives you full control over compatibility levels.

    PowerPoint now shows me font size changes in real time, and in 2013 it tells me when photos are alighted with the edges or centers of adjacent photos. I am not aware of any improvements for me in Word or Excel, on a variety of annoyances.

    Word does the same, and better yet, you

    I was happy with Word 2000. I hate searching around 2010/2013 ribbons for one thing. Gosh they make me annoyed. E.g. finding the insert table of contents (in the reference not the insert ribbon) or insert cross reference (in the insert rather than the reference ribbon).

    Just because you were doing it wrong for years doesn't mean it's better. Having all reference related thing on one page is good, and in fact, your "insert cross reference" item is in multiple places including reference tab!

    There was enough real estate to put all the comands I used on the "home" (or only) ribbon in 2000. In 2010/2013 I only get to configure the quick access toolbar which is not big enough for the buttons I want. I can't even configure it use drag and drop as was possible in 2000.

    That's entirely incorrect. You can make a custom ribbon with any items you want, in any order you want.

    I don't want to be able to touch my screen. I want to keep my fingers on my keyboard for as much time as possible. My screen (large and upright) is more than an arms distance away.

    That's why Office 2010/2013 has even more keyboard shortcut commands. And if you don't like those, you can make your own. Just because you don't know how to use the program doesn't mean it doesn't have the features you want.

  • -4

    basroil

    BertieWoosterJan. 30, 2013 - 01:35PM JST

    I bought and installed version 6 and soon wished I hadn't. The only way you could avoid losing data was to hit "Save" every couple of words.

    Let me guess, you also upgraded to a newer version of OSX?

    Then the committees got busy and they started adding bells and whistles in earnest. This didn't help the stability.

    Never had stability issues with 2000 to 2010, they all ran just fine, and perfectly compatible with each other.

    In recent years, stability has stopped being an issue and I can use Word without taking medication for high blood pressure. But, in my opinion, it is far too complicated and cluttered.

    That's like saying your music player is too complicated because it has 4 buttons rather than your old device that had just 3. There's nothing complicated about typing something, highlighting it, and just making text larger or smaller. Sure it has more depth, but most people never bother to look beyond the top layer. Hell, most of the Japanese guys I know don't even know that Office 2010 has save as PDF built in!

    They may differ from your ideas as we probably have different uses for word processors.

    Perhaps, but if you aren't using the normal features, you might as well not bother using a real word processor and stick with notepad/wordpad. Word only shows it's strength when you throw at it lists, references, captions, etc. Don't use styles? You're wasting your time and Word's strengths. Don't use tracking? You're missing out on one of the greatest collaboration tools out there. Don't use canvases? You're not doing charts right. Sure there's plenty of uses, but most of them involve things that don't need word at all.

  • 0

    Knox Harrington

    Microsoft Office's days of relevancy are behind it. Web enabled or not. There was a time when this was the only option and people had to use this. Nowadays there are options. Take a look at the menubar in Office. Is that a joke? Smack full of buttons and options, things that are not imminently necessary and ought to be hidden away.

  • -4

    basroil

    Knox HarringtonJan. 30, 2013 - 03:46PM JST

    Take a look at the menubar in Office. Is that a joke? Smack full of buttons and options, things that are not imminently necessary and ought to be hidden away.

    There's no "menu bar" in office 2010 or 2013 (or 2007, but 2007 was nowhere near as good as 2010, and only there to get people used to the new ribbons ). The "Home Ribbon", which is the first thing you see until you click on another ribbon tab, has copy/paste, fonts (there since 98 at least), paragraph settings (turn it to a list, increase spacing, etc, also where since 98), and styles (the only thing you should ever use in a document actually, makes reformatting a one click thing). No options (those can be found by clicking the tiny triangle at the bottom of each ribbon section), few buttons, most of it is hidden behind shortcuts or the little triangles. I think you haven't used office in ages.

  • 2

    zichi

    Pages is better than Word and Keynote is far better than Powerpoint.

  • 1

    flammenwerfer

    open office works for most basic spreadsheets and docs, high end users might be left wanting but it works for me.

    Google docs also works for what I want to do.

    online presentation software like prezi are improving.

    Microsoft are dreaming. CEO Steve Ballmer is worth 15 billion dollars and the greedy prrick wants more? Goodbye Microsoft. I don't plan to give them any more of my money. Linux, and Android are plenty enough for me.

  • 0

    BertieWooster

    No Basroil, Version 6.0 of Word was WAY before MacOS X.

    But the stability problem with Word had nothing to do with System 7.6 as it was then.

    I used to do my work in something that wouldn't crash every five minutes, like Nisus, WriteNow, WordPerfect or MarinerWrite and cut and paste it into Word and just hope it wouldn't freeze while it was doing it. I only did this because some of my customers wanted documents in Word format.

    And if you had no stability issues with early versions of Word on Windows, you were either very lucky or very tech savvy. So many times I heard the refrain, "Sorry, computer's down again!" I'm not saying that MacOS 7, 8 or 9 never froze or crashed. But all you needed to do was restart it or throw out a dodgy system extension. For Windows users, a crash often meant a weekend trying to reinstall the system.

    OSX is fast, completely stable and a mature OS.

    As for PDF, this is one of the truly useful things about OSX. You can save ANY document as a PDF, from ANY application. Since a long time before 2010.

    All the functions you mention, Track Changes, etc., are available in Pages, which is far easier to use and which produces good looking documents with much greater ease than Word. I'm not saying that you cannot produce good looking documents on Word in its current incarnation, it just takes A LOT of futzing.

    I agree with Knox Harrington, Microsoft's days of relevance are behind it. It's on the way out.

    I also agree with Zichi, Pages is a superior application to Word and Keynote is WAY better than PowerPoint.

  • -5

    basroil

    BertieWoosterJan. 30, 2013 - 09:53PM JST

    But the stability problem with Word had nothing to do with System 7.6 as it was then.

    I used to do my work in something that wouldn't crash every five minutes, like Nisus, WriteNow, WordPerfect or MarinerWrite and cut and paste it into Word and just hope it wouldn't freeze while it was doing it. I only did this because some of my customers wanted documents in Word format.

    99% chance it was the OS/machine, I used it way back when, and it was horrible. Even the built in games froze, usually because of memory errors.

    And if you had no stability issues with early versions of Word on Windows, you were either very lucky or very tech savvy. So many times I heard the refrain, "Sorry, computer's down again!" I'm not saying that MacOS 7, 8 or 9 never froze or crashed. But all you needed to do was restart it or throw out a dodgy system extension. For Windows users, a crash often meant a weekend trying to reinstall the system.

    You're trying to compare a 20 year old piece of software with a new one. That's like saying your Model T broke down too much so you are certain that the Fusion can't be any better. Office 2010/2013 have some really nice new features (http://www.shaunakelly.com/word/management/7-reasons-to-upgrade-from-microsoft-word-2007-to-word-2010.html), especially 2013's group productivity and online features (like powerpoint broadcasting without needing expression web) http://www.pcworld.com/article/2026567/10-killer-new-features-in-word-2013.html

    OSX is fast, completely stable and a mature OS.

    I have experience contrary to that, but that and any other comments relating to OSX (aside from being incompatible with software that old) are pointless and completely off-topic.

    I'm not saying that you cannot produce good looking documents on Word in its current incarnation, it just takes A LOT of futzing.

    Not at all, if you're doing that you're doing it wrong. Having preset styles is all you should ever need.

    Pages is a superior application to Word and Keynote is WAY better than PowerPoint.

    So why is it that professionals that need consistency in their publications use Word or Latex? ( http://www.ieee.org/publications_standards/publications/authors/author_templates.html )

    The reason is simple, Word is far more stable as a layout/processing engine, regardless of what false advertising is use when selling competing products.

  • 0

    BertieWooster

    basroil,

    I think you are confusing MacOS 7.6 with Windows 95 or possibly 3.1.

    Even the built in games froze, usually because of memory errors.

    There were no built in games in MacOS 7.6.

    MS Word versions after 5.1 regularly crashed. Other word processing software I used, such as MarinerWrite, WriteNow, Nisus and WordPerfect didn't. I was actually very disappointed. I liked Word 5.1, then suddenly, it became unusable.

    Since you don't appear to believe me, read on. It's not just my opinion:

    Many Mac users consider Word 5.1a to be the best version ever released. The original Word 5.0 for Mac reached the market in 1991, and the upgrade to 5.1 in 1992. After all those years, Word still worked very well on compact Macs with their 9" 512 x 342 pixel black and white displays.

    Word 6.0, launched in 1993, is widely considered to be the worst version of Word ever for the Mac, as it was based on the same codebase as Word 6.0 for Windows. That meant that it looked and worked more like Windows software than a Macintosh program. Mac users were so up in arms that Microsoft actually released a Word 5.1 downgrade to unhappy Word 6.0 owners.

    http://www.lowendmac.com/software/microsoft/word-for-macintosh.html

  • -1

    LostinNagoya

    I used Office for Mac for one year or so, after transiting from MS to Apple. But I started finding it too clunky in comparison to other native programs native to Apple, like iPhoto. I thought that there should be a nicer program, found Pages, tried it, but a little bit expensive to our small business. In the end I found OpenOffice and it's doing great for us. Don't see the need to buy MS Office. If I am going to spend some money on a office software, it'll be Pages.

  • -4

    basroil

    BertieWoosterJan. 31, 2013 - 12:20AM JST

    I think you are confusing MacOS 7.6 with Windows 95 or possibly 3.1.

    When you get windows to run on a Motorola 68000 chip tell me. I've used macs from the Classic to G5 workstations, including the PowerMac series running system 7.

    There were no built in games in MacOS 7.6.

    Macintosh Performa models came with a bit of added software including the famous Power Pete. They also including ClarisWorks, which never worked and was absolutely pathetic by modern standards.

    MS Word versions after 5.1 regularly crashed.

    I have had near perfect stability with Office since 2003. Only times I had it crash was when I filled up a computer with random garbage files and maxing out the memory (macro "virus" i made when I got bored, cleanup was a pain... not much you can do when you don't have space left for a page file) or when I use more than 2GB memory in excel (not normal, usually the result of poor choices on my part). I think you should stop talking about 20 year old versions of Office until you actually use the new ones for a month.

  • 1

    Aleenik

    Why use MS Office, which cost money, when you can download and use LibreOffice for free? Free and open source software ftw.:)

  • 1

    blackrock

    Why use MS Office, which cost money, when you can download and use LibreOffice for free? Free and open source software ftw.:)

    I admit that I use LibreOffice, but it sucks if you save documents in MS Office's formats. That's why for really important documents, people have to use MS Office.

  • 1

    BertieWooster

    LostinNagoya,

    I used Office for Mac for one year or so, after transiting from MS to Apple. But I started finding it too clunky in comparison to other native programs native to Apple, like iPhoto.

    A good description.

    iPhoto is superb, especially considering that it's free software.

    Word is great for people who like to futz with computers. For those who just want to get on with the job, and produce quality looking documents without having to take the equivalent of a two year college program, Pages is great.

    I thought that there should be a nicer program, found Pages, tried it, but a little bit expensive to our small business.

    It's not expensive, especially consider its graphic functions. But if you want free, simple, easy to use word processing, Bean is great. It's fast and does most of what I need.

    In the end I found OpenOffice and it's doing great for us.

    Personally, I didn't like it. I felt that it suffers from a lot of the problems of MS Word. Far too complicated!

    Don't see the need to buy MS Office.

    Me too!

    If I am going to spend some money on a office software, it'll be Pages.

    Good idea!

  • 2

    zichi

    The zoho online suit is every good, used them since the site was born.

  • -4

    basroil

    BertieWoosterJan. 31, 2013 - 05:03PM JST

    iPhoto is superb, especially considering that it's free software.

    It's $15, so I can already tell you're just here to spread misinformation https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/iphoto/id408981381?mt=12&v0=WWW-NAUS-ITUHOME-NEWAPPLICATIONS&ign-mpt=uo%3D2

    Word is great for people who like to futz with computers. For those who just want to get on with the job, and produce quality looking documents without having to take the equivalent of a two year college program, Pages is great.

    It's not expensive, especially consider its graphic functions.

    iWorks (pages, numbers, keynote) ends up being $60 per computer, so it is VERY expensive for an average household using 3-4 computers (between children and laptops). It's cheaper to buy three years of Office 365, and you'll get $60 worth of skype calls in addition to OneNote (which there is no iWorks or OpenOffice alternative for)

  • 0

    lostrune2

    Everybody here learns how to use MS Office in univ, since it's practically given to us almost free both PCs and Macs, and since everybody uses it so it's easier with shared learning.

  • 0

    BertieWooster

    basroil,

    iPhoto came free with my iMac.

    I'm not spreading anything.

  • 2

    zichi

    Apple software, like iWork can be installed on all computers on the same network so a family with children with several computers only needs a single copy of the software.

    On the iPad all apps can be installed on all of them used by the family. iWork for iPad is broken down into Pages, Numbers and Keynote and the cost is very low, $9.99. Apple families need to spend much less on software than Windows families leaving more money to go and see a movie or visit a restaurant.

    OneNote is made available by Microsoft for iPads and is free.

  • 3

    zichi

    Even though I have Office 2013, there are plenty of free alternatives or online without spending a single penny.

  • -3

    basroil

    lostrune2Jan. 31, 2013 - 06:42PM JST

    Everybody here learns how to use MS Office in univ

    Late learning there I guess, I've always seen it taught in middle school and highschool, everything from typing and changing fonts to conditional data and form fields. With 2010/2013 now, it's even easier to do all that since you don't need to make custom vb scripts for everything like you used to in 97/2000

  • 0

    blackrock

    No No and No, you are all diverging from the main point. The point is that, if a document is edited on another word processor, then saved in MS format, it's broken. Imagine you go to an important presentation with a messed-up slide?

  • -3

    basroil

    blackrockJan. 31, 2013 - 11:38PM JST

    Imagine you go to an important presentation with a messed-up slide?

    How many times I've seen that happen, generally because they think that keynote files are somehow acceptable to show anywhere but on a mac. Office works great across all platforms, as long as you let it use the binary format (docx, xlsx, etc) and stay away from non-printable typefaces.

  • 0

    zichi

    With Keynote you can export to PowerPoint. When I'm giving a lecture or talk, I have my Keynote but I also have a copy of it in PowerPoint but it more limited than Keynote.

  • -3

    basroil

  • 3

    zichi

    Wrong, Keynote can be exported to PowerPoint, QuickTime, HTML, PDF, images.

  • -1

    Korlacan Khanthavilay

    If you think free software compares to MS Office, then you don't use all the features of Office. I wouldn't even think about using anything outside of Office, when I was writing my technical documents as an engineer.

  • 0

    blackrock

    If you think free software compares to MS Office, then you don't use all the features of Office. I wouldn't even think about using anything outside of Office, when I was writing my technical documents as an engineer.

    On Linux you don't have a choice, only Open/LibreOffice. But the document is broken if saved in MS format.

  • 1

    cleo

    I use Office because the people who send me work use Office, and they like to be able to actually see the changes i have made to the stuff they send me. Working on another word processor/spreadsheet/presentation and saving in Office format simply doesn't work. I wish it did.

    The biggest problem with the new web-based Office is that all information is automatically stored in Microsoft’s data centers. I can't imagine any of the companies I work for wanting Microsoft to have access to all their clients' confidential information.

    And why would anyone choose to pay $100 a year to use something that they can buy outright for $140? I don't get it.

  • 2

    zichi

    365 Home Premium subscribers receive 20 additional gigabytes of storage on Microsoft’s SkyDrive to supplement the 7 gigabytes that the company gives away to account holders for free.

    I use SkyDrice among others but I discovered this week, the US gov't, the FBI, CIA, NAS, Homeland, in fact all of them, can demand access to all data, without court permission, kept on a US based server if the owner of the data isn't American. This also applies to email servers. I think the majority of servers are in America and most of the ones I use are based there. I guess this applies to companies which aren't American.

    I don't keep anything of real importance on those servers. I keep my confidential documents, family papers etc on a server called Wuala which is based in Switzerland but more importantly when the data is uploaded its automatically encrypted so even Wuala won't know what the data is. You can get a free 2GB of space.

  • -4

    basroil

    cleoFeb. 02, 2013 - 10:11AM JST

    And why would anyone choose to pay $100 a year to use something that they can buy outright for $140? I don't get it.

    If you have 4-5 computers, it's well worth it. If you use skype (comes with it anyway), you have $20-30 (60min a month) of calling to any landline or cellphone in the world, and your entirely encrypt-able and secure skydrive account is worth about 20-30 bucks a year. Even just two computers pay themselves off just in time for office 2016.

  • 2

    zichi

    Microsoft is able to access all data on its SkyDrive

    http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-responds-to-skydrive-privacy-concerns

  • -3

    basroil

    You can enable your own encryption on your files before sending them to skydrive!

  • 2

    zichi

    Many people have a hard time even finding the start button on Windows, at least to some on this forum, hence the need for Windows 8. How many will know how to encrypt files before uploading to SkyDrive which is also against Microsoft's TOS agreement.

    You will not use any form of automated device or computer program that enables the submission of postings without the express written consent of Microsoft Corporation.

    http://wmpoweruser.com/watch-what-you-store-on-skydriveyou-may-lose-your-microsoft-life/

    Watch what you store on SkyDrive–you may lose your Microsoft life

  • -4

    basroil

    File encryption isn't against a TOS, only using horrible third rate iCrap apps is!

  • -1

    Korlacan Khanthavilay

    lol, zichi talking about MS having access to all data on Skydrive, when guess what Apple does. They have access to all data on iCloud. Of course they are going to have access to all of it. They kind of need to make backups of the data.

    Read the iCloud TOS. That link you posted zichi, is the exact same thing that can happen on iCloud.

    MS's TOS is really, no different than Apple's TOS. http://www.apple.com/legal/icloud/en/terms.html

    Termination by Apple Apple may at any time, under certain circumstances and without prior notice, immediately terminate or suspend all or a portion of your Account and/or access to the Service. Cause for such termination shall include: (a) violations of this Agreement or any other policies or guidelines that are referenced herein and/or posted on the Service; (b) a request by you to cancel or terminate your Account; (c) a request and/or order from law enforcement, a judicial body, or other government agency; (d) where provision of the Service to you is or may become unlawful; (e) unexpected technical or security issues or problems; (f) your participation in fraudulent or illegal activities; or (g) failure to pay any fees owed by you in relation to the Service. Any such termination or suspension shall be made by Apple in its sole discretion and Apple will not be responsible to you or any third party for any damages that may result or arise out of such termination or suspension of your Account and/or access to the Service. In addition, Apple may terminate your Account upon prior notice via email to the address associated with your Account if (a) your Account has been inactive for one (1) year; or (b) there is a general discontinuance or material modification to the Service or any part thereof. Any such termination or suspension shall be made by Apple in its sole discretion and Apple will not be responsible to you or any third party for any damages that may result or arise out of such termination or suspension of your Account and/or access to the Service, though it will refund pro rata any pre-paid fees or amounts.

    None of this is anything new and it's been the standard TOS for pretty much all online services in general for the past couple of years. It's like arguing that the Earth is flat.

  • 2

    zichi

    Korlacan Khanthavilay

    yes iCloud has access to data which is why for my secure documents I use Wuala which is encrypted on the upload. But I'm more concerned that the US gov't, the FBI, CIA, NAS, Homeland, in fact all of them, can demand access to all data, without court permission, kept on a US based server if the owner of the data isn't American.

  • -2

    basroil

    Korlacan KhanthavilayFeb. 05, 2013 - 06:12PM JST

    talking about MS having access to all data on Skydrive, when guess what Apple does. They have access to all data on iCloud. Of course they are going to have access to all of it. They kind of need to make backups of the data.

    Any company with a server has the same issue. With Microsoft's case, you can use your own encryption programs before upload, or better yet, use things like ciphercloud to encrypt your 365 web-apps too, and aren't against TOS (ichat version was in the works at one point, but seems crapple squashed that idea because they like insecure systems)

  • -2

    Korlacan Khanthavilay

    @zichi

    Have fun with Wuala, when Seagate buys Lacie and the US government can demand data from them. FYI, Lacie makes Wuala.

  • 3

    zichi

    @KoriacanKhanthaviley

    The American gov't can only demand access to data on servers based in America. Wuala servers are based in Switzerland. All data is automatically encrypted on the upload.

  • 2

    zichi

    @KoracanKhanthaviley

    Currently, Wuala uses AES- 256 for encryption, RSA 2048 for signatures and for key exchange when sharing folders, and SHA-256 for integrity checks. The NSA (U.S. National Security Agency) has approved AES-256 for encrypting "top secret" information and it is the most commonly used encryption algorithm for highly secure applications such as banking.

  • -1

    Korlacan Khanthavilay

    American government can demand access to data on any servers owned by an American company. Whether those servers are in foreign lands or not. It's called the Patriot Act.

    Also, do you really think the NSA is still using something they approved back in 2003 to encrypt "Top Secret" data? That they haven't moved to a higher standard. FYI, I use to work at NSA.

  • 2

    zichi

    Hi, the data on SkyDrive cannot be encrypted - however it is secured by SSL, so the traffic to/from is encrypted. http://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/onlineservicesoc/thread/22b73bec-fd1c-49cc-b958-1e49715b721c

  • 2

    zichi

    At the Office 365 launch, Microsoft U.K.'s managing director Gordon Frazer, gave the first admission that cloud data -- regardless of where it is in the world -- is not protected against the USA PATRIOT Act. http://www.zdnet.com/blog/igeneration/microsoft-admits-patriot-act-can-access-eu-based-cloud-data/11225

  • 2

    zichi

    LaCie isn't an American company. Data is encrypted on the upload. Password is only kept on your computer. Servers are in Switzerland, France and Germany.

Login to leave a comment

OR
  • 海外営業事務

    海外営業事務
    株式会社セドナエンタープライズ、Tokyo
    Salary: ¥220,000 ~ ¥400,000 / Month Negotiable
  • African Speaking Sales manager

    African Speaking Sales manager
    JPC TRADE CO.,LTD. (株式会社JPC)、Tokyo
    Salary: ¥200,000 ~ ¥450,000 / Month Negotiable Basic Salary + Incentives
  • Recruitment / HR Generalist

    Recruitment / HR Generalist
    Temple University, Japan Campus - テンプル大学ジャパンキャンパス、Tokyo
    Salary: Commensurate with experience plus transportation from/to TUJ
  • Program Assistant

    Program Assistant
    Temple University, Japan Campus - テンプル大学ジャパンキャンパス、Tokyo
    Salary: Commensurate with experience plus transportation from/to TUJ
  • Portuguese Speaking Sales Manager

    Portuguese Speaking Sales Manager
    Autocom Japan (オートコムジャパン株式会社)、Kanagawa
    Salary: ¥270,000 ~ ¥800,000 / Month Commission Based

More in Technology

View all

View all