Gunman kills 13, then himself at New York immigrant help center

Saturday 04th April, 11:28 AM JST

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SushiSake3 at 09:08 PM JST - 4th April

I was chatting to an aquaintance last week [lives in Georgia, U.S.) about how I thought the States would likely be the 'best' country to be living in if climate change hits the fan and global food and water supplies continue drying up.

He quickly replied "I don't think you would. If any fights or riots break out to secure food in the States, most people would be packing guns and it would turn into a turkey shoot."

U.S. guns laws led to this.
tclh at 09:30 PM JST - 4th April

Wong is chinese surname but Voong is NOT a vietnamese surname. Who is this man? It is so disturbing that there are frequent incidents like this one these days.
smithinjapan at 09:51 PM JST - 4th April

McCracken: "One in which everyone had a loaded gun, because I would realize how foolish it would be for foreign states to attack."

Not at all. You just get one foreigner to show up and pull out a gun and the entire country would finish itself for the enemy. For the past 8 year the US was ruled by fear, and it still seems to grip the general populace (nearly as much as the Japanese). Add to this mix everyone having a loaded gun I guarantee you would see at least 2 million gun deaths a year, probably more. Sounds like a ridiculous number, I know, but so does your current actual death rate involving guns to anyone with a brain, and not everyone has a loaded gun.

What's more, no one would ever want to visit the US, and rightly so. Any tourism based business would collapse.
Mark_McCracken at 10:44 PM JST - 4th April

You just get one foreigner to show up and pull out a gun and the entire country would finish itself for the enemy.

That's illogical.
buddha4brains at 10:48 PM JST - 4th April

Seems that the shooter is no different than suicide bombers elsewhere. Willing to die for an agenda that involves murdering others. I am beginning to suspect that the mental process that a shooter goes through to justify his actions is similar to a suicide bomber.
maheshvitekar at 11:32 PM JST - 4th April

The arms industry in USA is the most powerful. Most of the areas where violence is unabated is fuelled by it. Your guns are going to kill you one day! The urgent need is to rein in the production of arms and their free supply from taxpayers' money.
bamboohat at 11:37 PM JST - 4th April

the fact that this nutter got a gun, legally or not, is just a symptom of the problem. If a gun was completely impossible, then he might not have done, it, but the hate and rage would have remained. That is the bigger issue.

There is much anger in America. Taking away guns won't do anything to pacify this.
SushiSake3 at 11:40 PM JST - 4th April

bamboohat - "There is much anger in America. Taking away guns won't do anything to pacify this."

Of course it will. If you take away the guns, then people won't be able to use..um...guns to blow other people away like this guy did.

It's not rocket science.

Or is it????
smithinjapan at 11:52 PM JST - 4th April

Sushi: "Of course it will. If you take away the guns, then people won't be able to use..um...guns to blow other people away like this guy did."

Well, they could still use ninja stars and toaster ovens to kill people, now couldn't they! So it's not guns!! :)
30061015 at 12:09 AM JST - 5th April

similar to a suicide bomber

There is a sickness in the human heart that causes suicide in any culture. Culturally accepted suicide victims are just as dead in Japan without a gun or a shot fired. A gun is an inanimate object, a tool for good or evil. Guns don't "cause crime" anymore than a cow causes hamburger. If the Vietnamese immigrant used a gasoline bomb to kill everyone, this conversation would be way different. The same old simple knee jerk reaction to blame guns and not the Godless culture of drugs and violence that kids grow up in today will of course solve everything.
smithinjapan at 01:47 AM JST - 5th April

30061015: Agreed. Guns are inanimate objects, so why not get rid of them altogether?

That was a rhetorical question. While I can't think of anyone who would disagree they are inanimate objects, so would all agree that a paperback book is an inanimate object. How much damage do you think he would have done going into the same place and swinging the book around or throwing it at someone. Or let's say a gas bomb... how many people do you know have gas bombs in their home or fight for their right to carry gas bombs under the Second Amendment.

Again, we can agree that they are different inanimate objects, and we can likewise agree that different inanimate objects serve different purposes. Assault and hand guns serve no other purpose than to shoot other people, and you can stand a lot further away, shoot a lot more people, and kill many many more than you can with a book. You can deflect a book, you can fight back against a person who wields a book against you. Hell, you can even debate them on the merits of the content; you cannot do the same (save for the latter, possibly) with a gun or the bullets fired.

Time for those who hide behind the 'guns don't kill people' logic to realize no one questions who the criminal is, but people with a brains in their heads know that someone with a gun can do FAR more damage and create far more carnage than simply with other inanimate objects. And again, if you want to counter with with 'gas bombs' or the like, remember that they are not the things people carry on them (in some states or illegally in others), go to shows to buy, sell at gun shops, buy for their kids, etc. People who defend guns don't defend gas bombs, so stop being childish.
Helter_Skelter at 02:06 AM JST - 5th April

If you take away the guns....

Sushi, there are nearly 200 million guns in America. And you want to confiscate them from law-abiding citizens who have registered them legally? Best start living in the real world.
SuperLib at 02:30 AM JST - 5th April

I haven't been reading the posts....but has anyone changed anyone's mind yet?
smithinjapan at 02:39 AM JST - 5th April

SuperLib: "I haven't been reading the posts....but has anyone changed anyone's mind yet?"

Nope... and no one ever really will through this kind of debate. The only time someone changes their mind is either just before they're shot by some nut, or when they get the news a loved one was killed, or worst of all if they accidentally shoot a loved one, and then suddenly the need to own guns becomes 'questionable'.

As for here, though... nope.
SmithUS at 12:31 PM JST - 6th April

With the economic collapse we've obviously entered an era of unbridled frustration because sadly this story is already old news. Other than the father in Washington who shot and killed his five kids, there's this story which is so appropriate to the usual shooting spree comments: "A gunman wearing a bulletproof vest and 'lying in wait' opened fire on officers responding to a domestic disturbance call Saturday, killing three of them and turning a quiet Pittsburgh street into a battlefield, police said." Apparently he was upset about losing his job and, according to his best friend, he didn't like "the Obama gun ban that's on the way" and "didn't like our rights being infringed upon."

There are guns, there are women and smallish men who in theory should pack the guns if protection is the main issue, and then there are guys who just love guns and equate them with their manhood and identity but always hide behind the self defense argument for greater moral justification lest they appear paranoid, uncivil, unsophisticated, reactionary, self indulgent.