Anti-fascist protesters breach security at BBC

Friday 23rd October, 05:34 AM JST

The requested article has expired, and is no longer available. Any related articles, and user comments are shown below.

› Login to comment

Latest 15 of 57 Total Comments Show All

kinniku at 04:09 PM JST - 25th October

The problem with blocking freedom of expression is:...

The problem with a lack of reading ability is that you can have trouble understanding that nobody block any thing or anyone and that pretty much no one here on JT has been suggesting that he should be blocked. Nick Griffin was on the BBC. You can see him on Question Time on YouTube as well as all of the videos detailing his racism.
kinniku at 04:09 PM JST - 25th October

Nice to see these "antifascists" behaving like fascists.

Free speech for all means that both Nick Griffin has a right to be heard as do the voices of the protesters. That is democracy.
grafton at 11:15 PM JST - 25th October

skipthesong and kinniku

I´m not sure if this thread is still live but if so then thank you both for your comments. Plus you do both realise that we all nearly agree? Skip, I am near enough in exactly the same position as you and as such know perfectly well where I would stand with the BNP. The real harm that has been done in the UK has been done by weak government pandering to those that make the loudest noise. Yes that is the pointing the finger at Muslims in this case. They have created ghettos, they have made segregation a part of their lives yet they have also impinged on the lives of the indigenous people by making demands that no host country should have ever tolerated. Immigration in and of itself is not a bad thing, but in the case of Britain everything has got out of balance. It is a small over crowded island, immigrants have been pandered to as part of a political ideology and the indigenous population have been pushed to the back.

The BNP is a small monster that will need a lot of feeding before it gets really dangerous, sadly the UK government is feeding it with the discontent that is being generated by a myopic view of what they see is right. The Labour party is not listening to the voters and as such those voters are being driven into the arms of who they believe is listening to them, the BNP. But the BNP today is not the BNP that the British will have to live under should that monster ever get into power. Then the horror of the 1930/40s Germany will be visited on the UK.

In the meantime the Muslims in Britain have given the BNP more voters than any TV programme could ever do. In Germany the Jews were made the scapegoat of the Nazi party, in Britain the Muslims are doing the job on themselves without any help from the BNP.
sabiwabi at 05:15 PM JST - 26th October

The problem with a lack of reading ability is that you can have trouble understanding that nobody block any thing or anyone and that pretty much no one here on JT has been suggesting that he should be blocked.

I was responding to opinions expressed in the article and on BBC News that Griffin should not be allowed to express himself in public.

“Shame on the BBC!” one female protester yelled as she was being dragged out.

And so I still think that at the heart of this issue is:

Who decides which views can and cannot be expressed?

The BBC? The government?
sabiwabi at 05:18 PM JST - 26th October

Sabiwabi,In this instance you really do seem to know next to nothing about the subject.

Grafton, In this instance you really do seem to know next to nothing about what I have posted. Please do not rely on kinniku's distortions and misrepresentations.
kinniku at 07:53 PM JST - 26th October

Grafton, In this instance you really do seem to know next to nothing about what I have posted.

I disagree completely. Grafton has aptly pointed out that it seems you do not no anything about the subject (considering you have written absolutely nothing specific to the BNP or to Griffin). For example, you made a silly claim that you wouldn't not expect the protesters to protest against anti-Muslims, when that is exactly what they were doing.

Personally, I think you agree with the BNP much more than you are willing to let on. In fact, your response to both the BNP articles here has been tepid to say the least. You even went as far at the beginning of the discussion to claim that you did not understand why people were calling them supremacists (LOL!), and you continued with that strange line of thought even after it was proven that they were and are indeed racist white supremacists.

Please do not rely on kinniku's distortions and misrepresentations.

LOL! Heh, you sound like Griffin. Specifically, what distortions and mispresentations would you be referring to. There have been none on my part whatsoever. You seem to constantly forget (as Griffin often does when asked about quotes of his in videos he has been in) that everything we write remains here unedited (one of the many nice things about JT).

And so I still think that at the heart of this issue is: Who decides which views can and cannot be expressed? The BBC? The government?

In most country both the media and the governments do. In a free society, such as Britain, people are allowed to air opinions that people may find odious. That is why the BBC let him speak. So, what exactly is the point of your question?
kinniku at 07:55 PM JST - 26th October

I was responding to opinions expressed in the article and on BBC News that Griffin should not be allowed to express himself in public.

I forgot this part. This protesting is also a part of a free society. People are free to protest things they don't like. Welcome to democracy.
kinniku at 07:55 PM JST - 26th October

Grafton,

Another excellent post! Well done!
kinniku at 08:08 PM JST - 26th October

Grafton,

Sorry, I just wanted to add that average Muslims in the UK are not to blame. In fact, the real blame lies with the lying BNP. Extremism should not be tolerated. I just wanted to be clear about that. I realize you must have been talking about Muslim extremism (I hope so anyway) and not Muslims in general.
sabiwabi at 02:56 PM JST - 27th October

For example, you made a silly claim that you wouldn't not expect the protesters to protest against anti-Muslims, when that is exactly what they were doing.

That is indeed a silly claim, whatever the claim is. Unfortunately, I never made that claim. The same goes for most of your attacks against what you seem to think are my views. All you do is attack me by misrepresenting my views. If you had anything intelligent to state, you wouldn't need to do this.

That is why the BBC let him speak. So, what exactly is the point of your question?

Yes, and I believe it is a good thing that the BBC let him speak. But many feel that Griffin should not have the right to express his views. I am not saying you feel that way, just that many people do feel that way.

All I am saying is that if we start blocking people from expressing certain views, we have to be concerned about:

Who decides which views can and cannot be expressed?

The BBC? The government?
kinniku at 07:52 PM JST - 27th October

That is indeed a silly claim, whatever the claim is. Unfortunately, I never made that claim.

Yeah, you did.

sabiwabi 10:51 AM JST - 23rd October

I wonder if Sarah feels the same way about anti-Arab voices being heard (constantly) on the MSM.

Unless you have a ghostwriter you wrote that. Interesting how Sarah was protesting against anti-Arab voices on the BBC, ie the BNP and you had no clue whatsoever that that is what she was doing.

As you can see, I have not misrepresented your views at all. I have shown you didn't have a clue what the BNP was all about. Funny how you can never point to such misrepresentation. That is of course because I merely point out what you write. Funny how you try to deny what you write. Again, just like Griffin does.

But many feel that Griffin should not have the right to express his views. I am not saying you feel that way, just that many people do feel that way.

So? They have a right to their opinions. You are correct that I do not feel that way. I like the dirty laundry to be aired.

All I am saying is that if we start blocking people from expressing certain views, we have to be concerned about:

Yes, but people do have a right to protest that which they feel is offensive. That is their freedom of expression, too.

Who decides which views can and cannot be expressed? The BBC? The government?

Why do you keep writing this? I have asked and answered it. Do you disagree with my answer? If so, it would be more effective to specifically state your disagreement.
sabiwabi at 11:19 AM JST - 28th October

As you can see, I have not misrepresented your views at all.

No, you just don't understand them; and I am tired of explaining them to you.

Yes, but people do have a right to protest that which they feel is offensive. That is their freedom of expression, too.

Indeed.

Why do you keep writing this?

I think I made it very clear why I wrote that we must be concerned about:

Who decides which views can and cannot be expressed?

The BBC? The government?
dbung10 at 05:22 PM JST - 28th October

Free speach is one thing, inciting racial hatred is another. There are radical Muslims on one side that do this and there are extremists like Griffin that do it on the other.

They should be locked in a room together. They will probably find out they have a lot in common (the fact that they enjoy hating people). If they dont get along, we should just, i dunno, leave them in the same room until they do....
dbung10 at 05:22 PM JST - 28th October

speech
kinniku at 08:35 PM JST - 28th October

No, you just don't understand them; and I am tired of explaining them to you.

Probably because you write things like what you wrote yesterday at 2:56pm:

All you do is attack me by misrepresenting my views.

Then I write that I haven't misrepresented you views at all and then you admit that I haven't by writing:

No, you just don't understand them

So, you don't even understand what you write. BTW, I understood the words you wrote and responded precisely and specifically. You still haven't shown any supposed misrepresentation, neither have you shown any lack of understanding of your position. Your position is quite clear and reflected in your absolutely tepid response to the BNP and in fact you have claimed that there is 'at least there is some sort of logic to their argument', which is basically support for a clear and proven a racist argument. In addition, you still haven't explained how you managed not to realize that people protesting the BNP were protesting an anti-Muslim group. You know when you asked if the protest would also be willing to protest an anti-Muslim group. You have managed not to understand that your question did not and does not make any sense. I am not the only poster to point this out to you.

I think I made it very clear why I wrote that we must be concerned about:

No, you have not. Repeating the question over and over again, does not make it clear. This is especially true when the question was discussed and answered the first time you asked. Most, if not all, countries make decisions about what can be shown in the media both at the government and media level. Since the BBC did broadcast the show, did have Griffin on the show, and certainly has at least equally controversial guests on their programs, your already answered questions seems even more strange since you keep repeating it without discussing responses to it. Now, I know what you really want to say, as you have written it many times. Let me spell it out for you, okay? You want everyone to mistakenly believe that Jews control Western governments and media. You want people to believe this and hate the idea of this false conclusion. Then you want to use this false conclusion to encourage people to disbelieve Western governments and media because of your false claims that they are controlled by Jews. All the while you have made almost no comment about the BNP, their policies (which you did not seem to know about when you commented on the protesters as shown in your quote above) and in fact, you seem to feel their is some 'logic' to their racist argument.

Yes, I understand you fully.