Greece proceeds with referendum plan as creditors rebuff overture

The time has come for the creditors to face the music. They knew the risks of lending to Greece but they gambled everything on the assumption that Greece would always be bailed out by Europe. So far they have been entirely correct, but it's time to stop. Greece should just wipe the slate clean and default on all its debts just like any person who runs up a massive credit card bill that they can never repay. Any bail out money that the troika wants to hand over to the creditors as interest payments should instead be used to stabilise the Greek banks to keep Greece in the Eurozone.

How long until this insanity comes home to other Western nations such as France, the UK, America, etc.

The referendum was a tactical blunder by Tsiparis. As of late he indicated he would settle but now can't find a way to back away from the vote and the Eurozone is standing pat. And some polls have him losing which would be his downfall.

With people living on 60 Euro's per day, things look bleak. Perhaps they are now ready to be bought out by China and Russia, unless the EU gives them better terms. EU minus Greece will cause a sudden appreciation of the Euro, something the German export machine does not want.

"I have no idea of why this is happening."

Well, I have - year after year after year of Greeks kidding themselves that it was OK to retire early, have an overpaid, super-sized public sector and not pay their taxes on either a personal or corporate level, then expect the rest of the EU to pay for it. For the current Greek government to call their creditors "blackmailers" for refusing to throw more good money after bad is absurd.

Reality check time

@frontandcentre"then expect the rest of the EU to pay for it".

The rest of EU is paying for Bulgaria, Estonia and some other economically weak countries.

This Greek 's tragedy has many lessons for many nations which employ same entitlement socialism unaccountable spending beyond the futuristic means. The root of Greek's problems is not an overnight event, rather it shows a failure of quick fix policy of politicians who failed to see the real future. Will Venezuela be next? Did the Pope mention anything besides just praying for Greek? To move forward, Greek needs a real reform away from entitlement social structure.

M3M3M3

" Any bail out money that the troika wants to hand over to the creditors as interest payments should instead be used to stabilise the Greek banks to keep Greece in the Eurozone. "

....meaning that the same disaster is replayed again, only more expensive. Why in the world would you want that?

Instead, any bail out money that the troika wants to hand over to the creditors as interest payments should instead be used to give emergency aid to the Greek population, and help Greece with a fresh start with a new Drachma. (Of which the Greek government can print as much as it was, so the last thing you need to worry about is Greek bank liquidity).

Why in the world have so many people bought into that Euro-politico slogan that the Euro currency mistake is irreversible??

Sooner or later, the Euro-group, EC, IMF, ECB, the 200 plus bureaucrats of the 'Department of Directorate General for Economic and Financial Affairs' assigned to the task force for Greece, responsible for oversight, and Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras' Government will have to accept varying levels of responsibility for their failures, the list by no means exhaustive cannot quantify the damage to the economic and political stability of Europe.

Two overriding factors remain, Greece cannot remain a member of the single currency without tip to toe reform and a agreed compliance procedure to deliver promised restructuring, and sustainable debt relief. As a Quant the financials are compelling for Greek return to a flexible monetary independence and currency regime. But this would have to be supported by all institutions and will require debt mutualisation.

@WilliB

I don't think the same disaster would replay again because who in their right minds would ever lend to Greece again? I think Greece needs to stay in the Euro because the last thing the Greek people need is a government with its own printing press.

@itsonlyrocknroll

If you were in Greece would you vote yes or no?

"As long as it is in arrears on the IMF payment, Greece cannot get any more money from the organization."

That's saying there is a way out(temporarily). Maybe we'll hear that "someone" covered this payment, with strings attached of course.

Any wagers on who might be that someone?

Tsipras insisted, it would give the government a stronger negotiating position with creditors.

A citizenry enjoying capital controls means that Tsipras has no negotiating position at all. This clown should man up, admit his policies have been a complete failure, and just resign instead so that realistic resolutions can quickly be pursued.

Hi M3M3M3, I would vote yes, and negotiate as if my life depended on it. The most important first priority is stabilizing the banking system cannot have pensioners climbing over each other for €120, however said from the luxury of a armchair.

@itsonlyrocknroll

Thanks. I agree with you in the long run. But from a political point of view, I wonder if voting 'No' could also stregthen Greece's negotiating position (or whatever is left of it). In any case, it was really strange to put this to a referendum. I'm still optimistic about how this all turns out.

Hi M3M3M3, German Chancellor Angela Merkel is exercising more control over the proceedings, insisting that a no vote will mean exit from the single currency, and even threatening Greek EU membership.

This is not the behavior of a democrat, it harps of a Dictator convinced that they can exercising absolute power. The Greek debacle, naturally Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras' Government should shoulder a proportion of the blame, has hardened my suspicions that any form of political union under the authority of the EU would not be desirable, I am a avid supporter of the single market. Reform of the EU institutions are desperately needed

Of all the political leaders, David Cameron is the least well equipped to produce a convincing argument for EU reform. It not Cameron family background or the school he went too, Cameron is not a man of the people., to bring about change one needs the character, cunning, and charisma to influence as a statesman, Cameron and Osborne appear out of their depth, talking down, with the attitude of a school prefect. Yet Cameron is the only act in town that making concrete proposal for debate, though not inspiring confidence.