Iran hangs 9 convicts, including 1 woman
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0
smithinjapan
"Murder, rape, armed robbery, kidnapping and drug trafficking are all punishable with the death penalty under Iran’s Islamic penal law."
If anyone on earth needs a bit of reminding as to why the death penalty should be abolished, here is one. Don't say, "Ah, well... we agree with Iran that murder should be punished by murder, but not rape," etc. Nothing should be punishable by death, ANYWHERE. Again, a shining example of why the death penalty should be banned.
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SuperLib
Well said.
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adamantine
It needs pointing out that saying the death penalty ought to be banned in revolutionary Iran is tantamount to demanding that Islam be outlawed.
I believe the Left designate such opinions as 'hate speech' and 'Islamophobia.'
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smithinjapan
adamantine: The worst example of an attempted syllogism I've seen in a long time. By your logic -- or perhaps only by your lame analogy -- me saying, say, the death penalty should be banned in the US makes me against Islam.
Ummm... yes, speaking out against Islam simply for the sake of doing and suggesting it needs to disappear is tantamount to hate speech, for sure, and is certainly Anti-Islam; but saying the death penalty is wrong is not in any way some sort of 'Islamophobia'. Again, said example of comparisons there.
And again, Islam is a shining example of why the death penalty should be banned outright. So long as you have countries that say it's okay, you'll have countries that will do it for anything and simply say, particularly to other countries who also promote the death penalty, "We both do it, now respect our methods and we'll respect yours," and you'll have." Said other countries that promote it cannot whine about how others exact the laws because they do it themselves as well.
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adamantine
"Murder, rape, armed robbery, kidnapping and drug trafficking are all punishable with the death penalty under Iran’s Islamic penal law."
0
likeitis
And we all know there are plenty of conservatives out there who support death for all those crimes and more but stay silent because ideals take a back seat to politics for them. They would not want to pat Iran or Islam on the back even if they do agree, eh?
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SuperLib
So what are your thoughts about Iran, lieitis? Or is there more you need to add about conservatives?
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likeitis
I disagree with the death penalty whereever it is done. I lambaste anyone who favors such barbarism.
I will praise Iran when it is correct. I will slam Iran when it is wrong. I will withhold an opinion on Iran when I lack evidence.
I find the Iranians to be a powerful people screwed over by history and foreign intervention and now, an authoritarian theocracy. I would not wish that situation on anyone. But as much as I may have a distaste for their government, that does not mean that every little thing they do is wrong, nor every thing we do against them is right.
And I won't say anymore because it will be off topic.
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rurika
You can also add being a gay man or a woman who has committed 'sexual offences' (such as being a victim of rape!) to that list. And let's not forget that Iran hangs children too.
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likeitis
rurika, can you back up your claims?
You know, I can't say I am a fan of Iran, but I think you are construing relatively isolated and habitually misreported events as being commonplace and adequately investigated.
Here is an example of how our press is rather irresponsible in reporting on Iran:
http://www.washblade.com/2005/7-29/news/worldnews/iran.cfm
Our press is always trying to make sales by selling sensationalism. Accuracy does not sell as well.
I could just as easily say America executes the mentally handicapped, because it has happened. But it is not American policy to do such things even if it does sometimes happen.
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adamantine
Yes, yes, how many "isolated" cases of state executions of "adulteresses" (stoned to death) and homosexuals (hanged, for some unaccountable reason, from cranes Iran purchases from the hated infidel) before Iran's Lefty apologists in the West condemn Amadhinejhad and the pro-Khomeini mullahs?
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likeitis
We were talking about HANGINGS adamantine.
You want to bring up that nice Old Testament tradition, STONING TO DEATH, fine. But don't pretend anyone here denied it. It might also interest you to know that men are also stoned to death for adultery, so consider your attempt to make it a gender discrimination thing thwarted.
You seem to be saying homosexuals were hanged for the crime of being homosexual. Yes? Provide proof. Not that I am denying it. I just grow sick of weeding through guesses and hearsay and hate driven/evidence free statements.
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rurika
Likeitis, the link you included doesn't mention that the iranian police has broken into houses where gay men were known to congregate and accuse some of them of rape, despite the fact that all the men present were willing participants. Then these will be included in the statistics as rapists when their only crime was to have taken part in an orgy in a private place.
The number of gay men who have been executed since the extremists took power in 1979 isn't known, but some sources talk about several thousands: http://www.glapn.org/sodomylaws/world/iran/iran.htm
This is a BBC documentary on the execution of a teenage girl (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ateqeh_Rajabi). A good insight into the sentences given for 'crimes against chastity' such as a girl being alone in a car with her male cousin(!). They also explain how the so-called 'moral police' and revolutionary guards abuse their powers and rape girls, knowing only too well they will not report the rapes. WARNING: parts of this documentary are disturbing.
http://jp.youtube.com/watch?v=fTv6ZDRyqe8
http://jp.youtube.com/watch?v=Tki1CMlvlqk
http://jp.youtube.com/watch?v=vZD3wXrIAn4
http://jp.youtube.com/watch?v=eDUKt8oUu4o
http://jp.youtube.com/watch?v=YgfK2NbJlg0
Quote below from Amnesty International:
"Since 1990, Iran has executed at least 37 juvenile offenders, eight of them in 2007 and at least six to date in 2008. No other country is known to have executed a juvenile offender in 2008. "
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likeitis
rurika, as I have said many times I am no fan of Iran or the way they do things. But your refusal to play fair does you no credit.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ateqeh_Rajabi
Do you really feel so darn sorry for Ateqeh? Do you really think her case deserves to be mixed with a passing mention of being alone with a cousin as a crime of chastity??? Agreed she should not have been executed. Even the Iranian gov agrees since her judge was later arrested and executed himself. But that girl was arrested for adultery no less than THREE times before the fourth time got her executed.
On her fourth arrest it was revealed (albeit under torture) that she was raped by a married man but continued to see him. Far more serious is adultery with the married. During the trial she threw her shoes at the judge, who I say again was executed for hanging her.
The girl had a tough life, that much is obvious. But in Iran adultery is a very serious offense. It used to be with us too, and still is if you read the bible. I hope to goodness they pull themselves out of the dark ages some day like we did. But don't act like this girl had no chance to save herself. She did the unthinkable THREE times and was even lashed for it. You seem to want us to believe she was grabbed while on her first date and hung and that that is commonplace. Its not!
But not for being gay. For engaging in GAY SEX, which is basically adultery again. Its a serious offense, it used to be with us too. Yeah, again, I hope one day Iran will get onto the same page as us. Until then, no gay sex.
just 37? In 18 years? As someone who is fine with 13 year olds being tried as adults, all I can say is that I am against the death penalty. The trouble with that bland statement is that you don't know what their crimes were or even the average age. Are you going to remain all indignant if half were 16 year old killers?
Another problem is that clerical courts work almost without supervision. Even with Ateqeh, some fool took one look and declared she was 22, depite evidence that she was 16.
It seems to me the Iranian clerical courts need a complete overhaul. Nitpicking at details is not going to accomplish anything and neither is accusing the whole of Iran and its people when its clerical courts are what is out of control.
I will watch the documentary when I have time.
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likeitis
To be fair, I revise this to two times. The third arrest did happen, but it seems she committed no offense between the third and fourth arrest so its not fair to make it look like she had a chance after the third arrest and punishment. Still, you would think twice would be enough, even if the charges are bullcrap.
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likeitis
rurika,
Okay, so are going to back any of this up?
Hangings for being gay (as opposed to hung for engaging in gay sex)
Hangings for getting raped
Hangings of children (as opposed hanging juveniles which is not the same as children)
Or are you going to admit that you made a careless irresponsible statement that turned out to be untrue? Or did you intentionally mix terms to exaggerate your case?
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likeitis
Watched the documentary. I had seen it before actually.
Bizarre that the married taxi driver who raped her got either 91 or 100 lashes (I think the people contradicted eachother in there). But it would not be first thing they apparently got something wrong in their desperate rush for sympathy (which is understandable, but hardly helps us make sense of all this).
You got to love how they throw in the fact that the guy would have been done up for statutory rape in the west. Who cares? The guy could have been done up for FULL ON RAPE anywhere. And according to Shariah he should have been stoned to death for being married and committing adultery. No need to bring statutory rape into this at all. It takes away from the simple fact that had Shariah and Iran's own laws been followed, no one would have much to say about this. In fact, some would have applauded the taxi driver's death.
I just can't figure out why she kept going to see the guy. It would be different if she was just gullible. But after getting lashes for similar stuff, I would think she would stay away.
Moderator: Back on topic please.
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rurika
**Hangings for being gay (as opposed to hung for engaging in gay sex)
Hangings for getting raped
Hangings of children (as opposed hanging juveniles which is not the same as children**
Sorry but this is just semantics. We could argue whether a teenager is a child or a juvenile or whether being gay just means having a certain sexual orientation or actively engaging in gay sex. Does it matter? The main point of this article is that these things don't happen in most countries, they happen in Iran and we need to put pressure on Iran to stop.
As a woman, I feel another important point is the hypocrisy of the regime and the double standards where girls or women found guilty of immoral conduct receive much harsher sentences than men. This is more about fear and hatred of women than about maintaining moral standards.
I'm well-aware that not everyone will share my views but it isn't fair to imply that they are based on sensationalist journalism.
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likeitis
Like heck it is. When you say homosexuals are hanged it sounds like they had no control of their fate, and its just not true. Agreed its still not fair, but the difference between hanging people for being gay and for engaging in homosexual acts is huge.
Hangings for getting raped though, since you have presented NOTHING to back this up, how can you declare a semantics problem?
Yes it does. Teenagers have been recognized as adults for thousands of years. Some people getting it in their heads that teens are kids for a few decades hardly compares, and it would be completely foolish to expect the whole world to agree on such a thing over-night. And as I said before, I am all for having 13 year olds tried as adults in certain cases, and that is because I do not view 13 year olds as mere children.
People are executed everywhere. THAT is the real problem.
As a man, I agree. But overall, it looks like men get hung a LOT more than women.
Again, I would say that execution just needs to be stopped period.
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