Obama outlines plans to create 2.5 million jobs

Sunday 23rd November, 06:58 AM JST

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SuperLib at 02:48 AM JST - 24th November

I support the plan. But yeah, I know the federal government is really good at wasting things and I am concerned that there will be a lot of waste in the project. I'd like to see how he's going to keep oversight on this issue. I think someone like McCain could offer some ideas.

I don't see this as some kind of permanent shift in US fiscal policy. It's something that needs to be done to keep people working during the crisis, plus we get the benefits of the projects that will be completed. I like the sound of that a lot more than I like the sound of another hundred billion going to Wall Street. And the US isn't going to turn into Japan overnight where we're suddenly paving our entire coastline to create jobs. I just don't think that's going to happen long term.
Betzee at 03:03 AM JST - 24th November

You neglected to mention the need for simple proof to back up random statements borne of superiority complex and over-wrought nationalism, another facet of what is wrong with neo-conservativism, at least at the follower ranks.

I like the transformed you! So much better than the cranky, angry guy (with no sense of humor).

As for modernizing schools, I believe the junior high in the Minnesota town where I went to college was built as a public works project under Roosevelt. Many generations of kids have now passed through it hallowed halls.

Public works money can be used to modernize schools, many of which desperately need it. But as Obama pointed out, student performance won't improve unless more parents limit TV time and instill a love of learning at home.
Betzee at 03:41 AM JST - 24th November

I think someone like McCain could offer some ideas.

He does but there's no follow through:

Responding to a question about the controversial awarding of no-bid contracts to Halliburton in the documentary film Why We Fight, McCain concedes, "It looks bad. It looks bad. And apparently, Halliburton more than once has overcharged the federal government. That's wrong." When pressed on how he would tackle this problem, McCain boldly declares, "I would have a public investigation of what they've done."

Yet he never launched such an investigation into what Americans, or Iraqis, were getting for all the US taxpayer's money which was spend. We certainly can't afford a public works program run like the reconstruction of Iraq, that's for sure.
Taka313 at 06:42 AM JST - 24th November

Superlib, It may have nothing to do with their political views, but it has everything to do with who they, in large part, are. You may now knock yourself out screeching about broad-based generalizations.

I can take that hit and stand by my words.

Taka
SuperLib at 09:26 AM JST - 24th November

Taka why not just take a few minutes to read this. I've given you the link before:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoconservatism

I've seen you throw around the word "neocon" so loosely that now the word really has no meaning for you anymore, it's just used to define anyone you don't like.

Betzee, you're giving anecdotal evidence.
Betzee at 09:50 AM JST - 24th November

Betzee, you're giving anecdotal evidence.

No, I provided an illustrative example of McCain's commitment (or lack of it) to ferreting out federal government waste. Bottom line, it was lower on his list of priorities than supporting the war. His staff made more inquiries on how Eugene Jarecki, the director of Why We Fight, was going to use that interview than the Senator did investigating cost overruns in Iraq.

This is an example of using anecdotal evidence to support a point of view (extracted from one of VOR's posts):

I just relocated back to the United States and there is a ton of infrastructure construction already going on.

Presumably he's referring to infrastructure he's noticed under construction wherever he lives, unlikely to constitute a representative sample from around the nation. By contrast, I've never seen a shred of evidence McCain was actually able to reign in pork barrel spending, only that he talks about.
sailwind at 11:36 AM JST - 24th November

No, I provided an illustrative example of McCain's commitment (or lack of it) to ferreting out federal government waste.

By contrast, I've never seen a shred of evidence McCain was actually able to reign in pork barrel spending, only that he talks about.

You didn't look very hard. The New York Times your favorite was all over it as to McCain's ability to reign in the bacon.

That posture led to his frequent criticism of pork-barrel spending, a McCain target not confined to military budgets but one where the Pentagon figured large. He tangled with Speaker Newt Gingrich, Senator Trent Lott, the majority leader, and even the Appropriations Committee chairman, Senator Ted Stevens, over money matters they had slipped into bills.

Mr. McCain has not won any big floor fights over pork. But even Mr. Stevens says his opposition can be used to scare off some greedy members with warnings like, ''If you do that, McCain will be after you.''

But it is not an issue that wins him friends.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9A01EFD81738F937A35750C0A9669C8B63&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=2
Betzee at 12:05 PM JST - 24th November

Sailwind,

McCain is hardly the first senator to make an issue of pork barrel spending. William Proxmire had his "Golden Fleece Awards" which were listed in the Congressional Record. Yet what, in the end, does shaming colleagues by exposing projects of little public value accomplish? Not much given the need to keep important constituents happy when it comes time for reelection.

By contrast, someone who convenes hearings on cost overruns in the no-bid reconstruction contracts would have performed a real public service. Could this service be delivered more cheaply? Does this project provide value for money? These are questions which should be asked when public money is being allocated for any purpose. The GWB administration's response was, "In a war we don't have time for that." I think most Americans would beg to differ.

Moderator: Readers, please keep the discussion focused on Obama's plans.
Sarge at 07:38 PM JST - 24th November

taka313 - What it is, is, I'm disputing the 27% ( of U.S. bridges are structurally deficient or obsolete ) figure. If that were the case, U.S. drivers would be avoiding driving over a quarter of the bridges in the country, and - get ready - they're not!

Sarge
iganinkuten at 07:45 AM JST - 25th November

"We must do more to put people back to work and get our economy moving again."

I like the whole "get our economy moving again" part, but the part about going back to work to get that to happen is not very attractive to me, though necessary.

What I'd like to see is the implementation of other systems that aren't dependent upon the current monetary system. I mean...they say money isn't everything but I'm not seeing any other options to accrue wealth and well being. Such a notion would impress me...
Sarge at 07:20 AM JST - 26th November

This plan will never create 2.5 million private sector jobs. 2.5 million government jobs maybe. But then that's the goal here - make government bigger and more intrusive.
ESJ8341 at 04:59 AM JST - 27th November

Betzee,

Here in Shanghai which in my opinion is in many ways far more capitalistic than America, the average worker makes a smidgen over a dollar an hour. In New York, the lowest level unskilled manual worker is going to make over 32 bucks an hour. Long story short: New York's problem isn't the need of public works, or other government bail outs, but unions, onerous taxation, and stifling regulations.
teaabe at 04:30 AM JST - 28th November

a buck an hour? trump it up to communism that you could earn nothing. but i'll still consider the lower costs to live there as an offset to earning only a buck an hour. yet, i don't think the world envies China and her well known reputation as a poor country. may be someday it'll change, but only after a long time because a buck an hour has a long way to go...
Wolfpack at 12:15 AM JST - 29th November

2.5 million jobs is much less than what is generated during a typical recovery. If he really walks on water, he should shoot for 25 million new jobs. That would be change we can believe in. Nah, let's just low-ball it.
gogogo at 01:37 PM JST - 29th November

Do these roads need rebuilding? Creating jobs is one thing but the money could be used in other areas, but I'm glad to see big business isn't getting the money