Monday May 28, 2012

Obama postpones Asia trip to focus on health care

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  • 0

    SushiSake3

    Unusual protocol for a POTUS but otherwise a wise move. Best that he stays in DC to knock heads to win against a Right wing-fuelled tide of anti-American propaganda. Not passing this bill will clearly have far greater financial ramifications than doing so. And despite ongoing conservative claims to the contrary, this bill is a relative bargain at less than $200b a year over 10 years. The conservatives who continually complain about the price tag should be asking themselves why they so readily supported the previous administration, one that burnt through $6 trillion and left us with a parting gift of a worldwide recession.

  • 0

    Sarge

    Sushi's right. The current problems we face are entirely the fault of the previous administration.

  • 0

    Odogma

    Not passing this bill will clearly have far greater financial ramifications than doing so.

    Another amusing analysis from SS3. You are in America? You have lived there?

  • 0

    SushiSake3

    Odogma - do you have any idea about basic economics?

    Clearly not.

    Right wing propaganda is enough, no?

    Sarge - "The current problems we face are entirely the fault of the previous administration."

    Thanks for pointing that out. You are almost right.

  • 0

    SushiSake3

    Really, it's difficult to know which poll numberr are even close to reflecting reality. I doubt many thinking Americans buy what is coming out of Fox, particularly when they take alook at the recent work histories and hard Right leanings of the network's management team. And the true intentions of Americans won't even be accurately portrayed in the vote, considering the arm-twisting that is going on. I'm not saying any side has clean hands in this - obviously they don't - but what irks me is conservatives going off about big government spending when their party amassed the largest pile of debt for current and future generations of Americans than any govt. in history, while simultaneously saying less well off Americans shouldn't get health coverage. And many of the people saying this on JT are sitting prettx on their military pensions.

  • 0

    SushiSake3

    Odogma - 'You have lived there?' Is this some kind of lame litmus test to see who can and who can't make posts about American issues? Give up the pettiness, thanks. Odogma's embarrassing comment aside, I want to point out again - this health bill is nowhere near as expensive as conservatives will have you believe. It's less than $200b a year over 10 years. The federal govt. pays more than that in costs to service the national debt, much of which was racked up by Republicans (with conservative support, of course) - the same people who are complainimg about the...same debt mountain. Has anyone heard Rush Limpbough or Sean Hannity mention this interesting little gem? A psychological aside - I'm guessing the people who are going to criticize this post will do so in the knowledge that it is pretty bang on target.

    Moderator: Readers, in order to maintain a high level of discussion, please refrain from posting derogatory variations of names, such as "Rush Limpbough."

  • 0

    SushiSake3

    Conservatives decry a 'government takeover.' Even if that was the case, it's lame in comparison to the GOP-led govenment takeover, sorry - outright insane misappropriation - of $6 trillion under thhe previous administration - frittered away to the uber rich and 2 wars. This healthcare bill will at least see money going to ordinary Americans. For once.

  • 0

    ca1ic0cat

    Obama may finally be figuring out how DC works. But I doubt he'll be taking any trips for a while. Might even cut into his golf schedule. For shame!

  • 0

    GJDailleult

    The current problems we face are entirely the fault of the previous administration.

    Actually the current problems are entirely the fault of four of the last five administrations.

    And instead of flipping out over a trivial health insurance subsidy bill, Americans should really take the time to figure out who their real enemy is. Hint, Limbaugh and Beck aren't going to tell you, because they work for the enemy in the "Divide and Conquer" department. The enemy are those who are destroying your country for personal profit, and they are quite happy to see the serfs battle each other over who pays the doctor bills.

  • 0

    SushiSake3

    Is anyone else wondering why the same conservatives who are now decrying backroom dealings for this healthcare overhaul said nothing when Cheney and the GOP engaged in exactly the same type of backroom dealings with big energy and oil bosses? Yet again, this underlines the breathless hypocrisy of the American Right.

  • 0

    adaydream

    Yeah it's a good idea to go on and cancel the trip and stay to finalize this. < :-)

  • 0

    SushiSake3

    It's a fair guess that conservative shrieking will reach an as yet unheard of cresendo midnight Saturday. Sailwind, can I borrow some earplugs? :-)

  • 0

    Odogma

    It's a fair guess that conservative shrieking will reach an as yet unheard of cresendo midnight Saturday.

    You meant "crescendo", yes ? Since it is used to describe a sound which gets louder and louder you are correct - - if only because Obama's traitorous contempt for the US Constitution has turned a great many moderates and independents against him and his crooked party.

  • 0

    Odogma

    Americans should really take the time to figure out who their real enemy is. Hint, Limbaugh and Beck aren't going to tell you, because they work for the enemy in the "Divide and Conquer" department.

    Who, precisely, is this enemy you speak of? Give them a name please.

  • 0

    SushiSake3

    Odogma - "if only because Obama's traitorous contempt for the US Constitution."

    Which part, precisely, of the Constitution does the president have "traitorous contempt" for? Provide precise text, please.

  • 0

    Odogma

    Obama and these Democrats just lie and lie and lie:

    (CNSNews.com) – " If Congress passes the Senate health-care plan, according to an analysis by the *Congressional Budget Office*, American families will be *required by federal law* to buy a federally approved health insurance plan that will cost *a minimum of $12,000 per year*--and, on average, will cost $15,000 per year -- whether their employer or the government helps them with the premium or not. "

  • 0

    Odogma

    SS3 - Article I, Section 7, in order for any "Bill" to "become a Law," it "shall have passed the House of Representatives and the Senate" and be "presented to the President of the United States" for signature or for veto.

    Unless a bill has "passed" both Houses, it cannot be presented to the president and cannot become a law. These laws were made to hold politicians accountable. Obama,Pelosi,Reid and these criminal Democrats are in contempt of the Constitution. They are traitors.

  • 0

    Odogma

    Democrats aren't voting on health care reform - - they are voting to trash the US Constitution. There will be revolt across America.

    AP reporting: " BOISE, Idaho — Idaho took the lead in a growing, nationwide fight against health care overhaul Wednesday when its governor became the first to sign a measure requiring the state attorney general to sue the federal government if residents are forced to buy health insurance.

    Similar legislation is pending in 37 other states "

  • 0

    5SpeedRacer5

    You know what? If Americans can't pass it, they don't deserve it. What a bunch of losers. Can't even get a decent health care system together to help your citizens. Other countries solved the problem half a century ago and here are Americans, dying in potters' fields because nobody is humanitarian enough or smart enough to know their own best interests.

    Why be polite about it? Here is Obama cancelling schedules and pulling out all the stops to get something passed for a nation of backward ignoramuses. The first bill should have been shoved through. The enemy is not the Republicans, it is poor health and ignorance, so it should have sailed through. Push the Republicans aside and DO IT if it is for the benefit of the Republic! All that is left now is a watered down piece of pork thrown to the fat cats and precious little permanent benefit for Americans who need it.

    Michael Moore is ashamed of the Democrats and he should be.

    I remember a country that went to the moon and split the atom. Now Americans can't solve a social problem that many "lesser" countries have banished forever with the stroke of a pen and a teeny bit of will. Time and again, America shows the world that resources do not matter a whit. Without direction and will, they just waste what they have.

  • 0

    sailwind

    Other countries solved the problem half a century ago and here are Americans, dying in potters' fields because nobody is humanitarian enough or smart enough to know their own best interests.

    North Korea, Cuba for example?

    The best interests of the American people is to be able to make their own decisions as to how take care of themselves and families. Health care is not a God given right it is a necessity just like food, clothing and shelter. And when you go to grocery store you buy your food and make what food choice decisions you think is best for your family and balance that with what you can actually afford based on your income. You are in control. If you are poor then the American Government will provide help such as foodstamps along with local charities, just like foodbanks and feeding the homeless. Healtcare in America is no different since the republic came into being. It has followed the same example that I have used above for food. America has 'free clinics' and Medicaid for the poorest members of the society. What those of you that aren't Americans have failed to grasp is this. Our system is designed to provide the bare basics to the lowest rungs of society but not enough to provide an incentive to stay there and not try to move up and away from those circumstances. American society has always been feed from the bottom up not the top down.With immigrants flooding the shores for that very chance to better their lives through hard work and flat out grit and determination. This bill is a massive step away from that and many great many Americans such as myself do really fear that this may really be the day when instead of moving up as a people and a society that gave you the very operating system your using and the Internet will now 'Go Galt' instead. This bill is nothing more than naked power grab by the farther left fringes of American society to ensure we all 'Go Galt' and jump into the cart instead of being allowed to pull it by ourselves instead.

  • 0

    Odogma

    Other countries solved the problem half a century ago and here are Americans, dying in potters' fields because nobody is humanitarian enough or smart enough to know their own best interests.

    Ridiculous melodrama. America's free market system and resistance to nationalizing health care benefits all of mankind. The US leads the world in basic medical science, diagnostics and therapeutics, something to recall next time the bogus claim that America is alone among advanced nations in its approach to health care. It is the other way around - 'advanced' medical care is available outside of America precisely because of what citizens inside America do.

  • 0

    Tatanka

    Sailwind, sounds like you are a fan of Ayn Rand. You probably read Atlas Shrugged. Health care is not a right. When people expect government to given them rights, government can also take them away. Our founding fathers knew this...

  • 0

    combinibento

    I dunno what's worse: Getting diarreah on a trip to Southeast Asia or listening to the Republican's dirreah of the mouth on why this one piece of legislation is going to turn the US into a socialist dictatorship.

  • 0

    motogaijin

    AP reporting: " BOISE, Idaho — Idaho took the lead in a growing, nationwide fight against health care overhaul Wednesday when its governor became the first to sign a measure requiring the state attorney general to sue the federal government if residents are forced to buy health insurance.

    Similar legislation is pending in 37 other states "

    Wow, impressive! Maybe the people in the great state of Idaho should go back to high school history where any good teacher would explain that federal laws trump state laws. In other words the governments in Idaho and whatever other state is trying to draw attention to itself at the moment will still have to abide by whatever laws are passed at the national level.

  • 0

    Odogma

    Wow, impressive! Maybe the people in the great state of Idaho should go back to high school history where any good teacher would explain that federal laws trump state laws.

    "Slaughter" is not constitutional. Idaho is right to fight the traitorous Democrats.

  • 0

    combinibento

    Idaho is right to fight the traitorous Democrats.

    LOL, I can just imagine the protesters taking to the streets throwing potatoes at the murderous gestapo in defense of grandma.

  • 0

    SushiSake3

    Sailwind - "The best interests of the American people is to be able to make their own decisions as to how take care of themselves and families."

    Americans drowning in credit card debt, obesity and a torrent of pharmaceutical drugs shows that idea is kaput.

  • 0

    SushiSake3

    Sailwind - "And when you go to grocery store you buy your food and make what food choice decisions you think is best for your family and balance that with what you can actually afford based on your income."

    C'mon, maybe you do that, but look at the rate of obesity in the U.S.

    • 60% plus.

  • 0

    SushiSake3

    Odogma - "Ridiculous melodrama. America's free market system and resistance to nationalizing health care benefits all of mankind."

    How you can say that with a straight face defies belief.

    The collapse of America's free market system only last year ushered in the worst global recession since the 1920s.

    Have you already forgotten that?

    We're still in the middle of it in case you hadn't noticed.

    What a ridiculous statement.

  • 0

    SushiSake3

    I always have a chuckle when I hear Americans like Sailwind implying 'Americans know best.'

    One simply has to take a cursory look at the mind-boggline level of national and personal debt, obesity, pharmaceutical drug use, packed prisons and disease to see this simply isn't true.

    Sometimes people do need to receive a slap around the head and told what to do, and I believe this health care bill is just that.

  • 0

    sailwind

    Sailwind - "And when you go to grocery store you buy your food and make what food choice decisions you think is best for your family and balance that with what you can actually afford based on your income."

    C'mon, maybe you do that, but look at the rate of obesity in the U.S.

    60% plus.

    Yup, that free market thing were farmers grow their own food and sell it for the best price but have to compete with other farmers to keep costs low enough to entice people to buy their produce.....sure puts alot of extra food on the table that Americans eat now. Let's 'reform' that next and do it like this bill does for health care in the U.S, and have the U.S Government force us to buy only healthy foods they have 'mandated' as good for us by law, and let's levy a high tax on those who still insist on buying sodas instead of Government blessed natural spring water. After all Washington knows best!

  • 0

    RomeoRamenII

    AP reporting: " BOISE, Idaho — Idaho took the lead in a growing, nationwide fight against health care overhaul Wednesday when its governor became the first to sign a measure requiring the state attorney general to sue the federal government if residents are forced to buy health insurance.

    In addition, Utah has just passed a measure mandating that their attorney general must sue the Federal government if Obamacare is passed with a mandate that US citizens must purchase healthcare. More states are set to follow.

    Putting aside the Constitutional violations that Pelosi is using to get this bill out of the house, the mandatory health insurance provision eventually will be struck down as unconstitutional.

    The tin ear democrats, liberals, progressives, or whatever they are calling themselves these days, are committing political suicide as they push this losing issue that 75 percent of Americans do not want.

  • 0

    SushiSake3

    Sail, so you're saying that you think high rates of obesity are OK?

    I would have thought you would have higher standards than that.

  • 0

    SushiSake3

    RomeoRamenII - "are committing political suicide as they push this losing issue that 75 percent of Americans do not want."

    There's that number again. :-)

    Are you sure it's not 57%? Or 175%?

  • 0

    RomeoRamenII

    federal laws trump state laws

    Read it and weep into your pillow, Motogaijin:

    Article V

    The Congress, whenever two thirds of both houses shall deem it necessary, shall propose amendments to this Constitution, or, on the application of the legislatures of two thirds of the several states, shall call a convention for proposing amendments, which, in either case, shall be valid to all intents and purposes, as part of this Constitution, when ratified by the legislatures of three fourths of the several states, or by conventions in three fourths thereof, as the one or the other mode of ratification may be proposed by the Congress; provided that no amendment which may be made prior to the year one thousand eight hundred and eight shall in any manner affect the first and fourth clauses in the ninth section of the first article; and that no state, without its consent, shall be deprived of its equal suffrage in the Senate.

    Moderator: Back on topic please.

  • 0

    combinibento

    Romeo, since when was the health care bill a constitutional amendment? LOL.

  • 0

    RomeoRamenII

    Are you sure it's not 57%? Or 175%?

    Nah, those are the types of numbers your hero, Obama, -- you know, the guy you said gets you "excited" when he speaks -- throws around ("57 states" in America, "it's estimated would see premiums fall by as much as 3,000 percent so they could give you a raise").

  • 0

    goodDonkey

    Next we need to get the public option.

    Then after that we need to go to a single payer system.

    One step at a time we can get what we want and need.

  • 0

    Sarge

    "His ( Obama's ) personal presence helps"

    Obama does have that charisma.

    SushiSakeThree - Thanks for the laughs!

  • 0

    Sarge

    "$940 billion health care bill"

    Sushi, do you believe this will reduce the deficit?

  • 0

    SushiSake3

    Sarge, stop being so simplistic.

    That amount is spread over a decade. It's a bargain and you know it.

    It will help reduce the number of people who don't get preventative care and who finish up in hospitals needing urgent - very expensive - care and who don't have the means to pay for it.

    What could have been treated for very small cost today escalates into a very large ongoing cost next year.

    Times a good few million.

    How is that going to reduce the deficit?

    I had dinner tonight with a very good mate from California.

    He made a few points real clear -

    1/ He's really ashamed at how 'stupid' and 'ignorant' many of his compatriats are (<- those are his words, not mine). He mentioned he saw a tea party protest where a health care opponent was waving a banner saying 'Get the government out of Medicare!' 2/ He can't work out how many Americans think 'me, me!' and don't have the emathy required to think of the welfare of others. 3/ He thinks a whole bunch of Americans don't have a clue about the meaning of 'socialism,' and can't rationalize that government intervention isn't all bad.

  • 0

    SushiSake3

    (some text was cut off there)...

    • He mentioned he saw a tea party protest recently where one healthcare reform opponent was waving a banner saying 'Get Government out of Medicare!'

    2/ He thinks many Americans can't think past 'me, me, me!' and are incapable of having empathy for the situations of others.

    3/ He thinks a heap of Americans have no idea whatsoever about the true meaning of 'Socialism' and also can't understand that not all government intervention is bad.

  • 0

    SushiSake3

    Sarge, ther's no perks in the healthcare bill for your state!

    Does that make it a socialist government takeover of healthcare that '75%' of Americans don't want?

    lol!

  • 0

    Sarge

    "Sarge, stop being so simplistic."

    Translation: You got me there.

  • 0

    usaexpat

    Postponed again eh? Gotta twist a few more arms to get people to throw themselves under the bus for his "leagacy". Passing a bad bill is not better than passing no bill. Welcome to a Republican majority in the next election. That's not necessarily good for the country or what I would like to see but the Democrats will be forced to pay for this as will my great great grandchildren and everyone down the line. The single worst piece of legislation since authorizing military action against Iraq. Bush screwed up abroad and Obama as a counter screws up at home, great.....

  • 0

    lrodriguezsosa

    Sarge: You mean government health care. No thanks.

    That said it all. Americans don't care for other people. So why we should believe their care for whales and dolphins? Oh, yes. Maybe they have some economical interests on the issue. Like always.

  • 0

    SushiSake3

    Sarge and other detractors of this bill will quite happily use government-run pension and welfare systems, but a government-run healthcare system?

    That must be socialist.

    lol! The hypocrisy and complete lack of logic in that is incredible.

  • 0

    Sarge

    "Sarge and other detractors of this bill will quite happily use government-run pension and welfare systems"

    Sure, Sushi, just make up stuff and post it, sheesh.

  • 0

    USAFdude

    Sarge, you mean you don't get military retired pay and benefits, including health care?

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