U.S. health care talks focus on illegal immigrants

Saturday 12th September, 06:41 AM JST

EVERETT, Washington —

Senators closing in on a comprehensive health care bill have whittled away all but the most contentious issues and one of those loomed large Friday: coverage for illegal immigrants.

Negotiators on the Senate Finance Committee thought they’d already resolved the question. That was before Republican Rep Joe Wilson’s shout of “You lie!” as President Barack Obama said in a speech Wednesday that illegal immigrants wouldn’t be covered under his health plan.

That led senators to revisit the issue to make sure they have provisions in place to enforce prohibitions against illegal residents getting federally subsidized coverage.

“What we are trying to prevent is anyone who is here illegally from getting any federal benefit,” said Sen Kent Conrad, D-ND, a member of the so-called Gang of Six of three Democratic and three Republican members of the Finance Committee. The group is facing a deadline early next week to produce a bipartisan deal.

If they don’t succeed, Chairman Max Baucus, D-Mont, plans to go it alone with a Democratic bill.

The outcome remains very much in doubt. A successful effort could form the basis for legislation that could appeal to a majority in the Senate since the Finance Committee has a moderate makeup that resembles the Senate as a whole.

This weekend will be critical as aides and lawmakers themselves hammer out language not just on illegal immigration, but also a handful of other thorny issues including abortion, medical malpractice and how much states must pay for an expansion of Medicaid.

The deal-or-no-deal question could be answered as early as Monday when the group meets again.

“Obviously we’ll find out who wants to support the bill and who doesn’t,” Baucus said Friday. “I’m hopeful that there will be bipartisan support. And I’ll keep working on it frankly over the weekend, on the telephone talking to people, so on and so forth.”

Baucus’ plan largely mirrors what Obama laid out in his speech Wednesday: expansion of coverage to most of the nearly 50 million uninsured, new requirements for individuals to obtain insurance, new prohibitions against insurance company practices like denying coverage based on personal health history and creation of a new marketplace called an exchange where consumers could shop for different health plans.

If Congress ends up creating a new government-run insurance plan it would be offered through the exchange, but unlike the four partisan bills that have emerged from committees in the House and Senate so far, Baucus’ bill will substitute nonprofit co-ops for the public plan.

The White House says that Obama does not want illegal immigrants to be able to buy insurance through the new purchasing exchange as they would be allowed to do under Democratic legislation in the House. Spokesman Robert Gibbs said the White House will work with lawmakers on language to enforce that, although the Finance Committee bill is also expected to let illegal immigrants shop in the exchange, according to a Republican Finance Committee aide. The aide spoke on condition of anonymity because the negotiations were ongoing.

“Illegal immigrants would not be allowed to access the exchange that is set up,” Gibbs said Friday. Verification requirements are “something we’d work out with Congress,” he said.

The illegal immigrant controversy that led to the outburst from South Carolina’s Wilson stems from Republicans’ contention that illegal immigrants would be able to get federally funded health coverage under the House health bill — even though the bill expressly prohibits federal subsidies for illegals.

Critics note that there are no enforcement mechanisms, or language on how to verify whether or not someone is in this country legally.

“Without a verification requirement it’s essentially like posting a 55-mph speed limit and not having any highway patrol on the road,” said Ira Mehlman, spokesman for the Federation for American Immigration Reform.

Democrats in two House committees defeated amendments that would have required verification of legal status. Many Democrats contend that such measures create barriers to legal residents getting the health coverage they need.

Verification provisions added to Medicaid several years ago require people to provide documentation of citizenship and identity, said Jennifer Tolbert, a policy analyst at the nonpartisan Kaiser Family Foundation.

She said states found that the new requirements mainly caused delays or denials for people who were entitled to be part of the program.

There are some 7 million illegal immigrants in this country who lack health insurance, according to the Pew Hispanic Center.

Unlike in the House bill or legislation passed by the Senate’s health committee, the Finance Committee is aiming to include verification requirements. Anyone who tries to get subsidized coverage through a new health insurance exchange would have to provide valid Social Security numbers. Aides are working through the weekend to complete how that requirement would be implemented.

Another unsettled issue involves coverage for legal immigrants. Gang of Six member Sen Chuck Grassley, R-Iowa, wants a five-year waiting period before legal immigrants can get subsidized coverage, but Conrad said Friday that’s not yet been resolved.

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Latest 15 of 53 Total Comments Show All

Klein2 at 06:51 PM JST - 13th September

You know how I know you are wrong? You know how I know that people will be helped and that the problems, if any, are negligible?

AARP.

That really is all that need be said. Those old fogies have gone over this bill with experts who have seen it all and done it all. They cannot be fooled. They are the core of educated conservatives and have been successful enough at negotiating and getting along that they have made it to retirement with money. Lots of it. They are such a powerful lobby that they could bat the NRA around like a ping pong ball. They want to protect their nest eggs and medical care and life from everything in the universe. That and playing golf and canasta are what they do in life.

AARP supports this bill unreservedly.

What that says to me is that the bill opposition is a lunatic fringe. Your parents and grandparents and kids are all going to be in support of this. Anyone with more teeth than tattoos will support it. Apparently the points that the fringe are objecting to are those that AARP thinks are no problem, but which Rush Limbaugh, in his infinite wisdom, sees as problematic. If AARP people thought for a minute that illegal immigrants were going to be a problem, it would be taken care of, no question.
sailwind at 07:58 PM JST - 13th September

Anyone with more teeth than tattoos will support it.

You might want to have a little chat with these toothless folks on that one.

http://www.wjla.com/news/stories/0909/658215.html

Happened two days ago right after his speech.
adaydream at 02:35 AM JST - 14th September

Alphaape

I think the real question that should be asked is where will it state that for people to enroll in the proposed national system they must be bona-fide residents.

We have the doctors checking for identification. They do that already by asking for insurance cards and driver licences. Maybe we'll have side doors close to the nurses stations that are doors for illegals to slip out?

Unless you have a job and/or job related health insurance (you have to be an American citizen or legal immigrant to get a job) then people have to be buying their private insurance from insurance companies. Part of their process is gathering your SSN. No SSN or legal entrance then no insurance.

You go to the doctor with out some kind of insurance, they want "CASH" or you don't get service. Doctors aren't working for free. So at what point is the illegal immigrant getting his service?

I'm still trying to grasp where the illegal immigrants will get their service that the GOP keeps crying about. < :-)
Klein2 at 05:26 AM JST - 14th September

Sailwind, are you trying to divide by zero?

I do not see tattoos in your link. Learn some math.
adaydream at 07:46 AM JST - 14th September

Hmmmm, I think Rush Limbaugh is an alien. If you look at him when he's red faced and really going for his point his antennas just barely poke through. He's a bad man.

Hell, I'm an old man and a member of AARP and AANR and I see nothing that is that problematic. < :-)
Molenir at 08:25 AM JST - 14th September

You could save far more money from cutting the defense budget, but it is equally unrelated to the problem at hand. It is a red herring. Just because it is a gorilla does not mean it is relevant. I think you understand English, right? A red herring is an unrelated distraction.

Defense and Health Care are 2 totally different animals. You understand English here right. Referring to Defense alongside health care is what is known as a Red Herring. Its a distraction that has no bearing on the issue. Tort Reform however has direct impact and bearing on the issue. Please note the difference here. The one would impact health care costs, the other one wouldn't.

AARP supports this bill unreservedly.

Well thats a lie. They don't support it unreservedly, they've stated that time and again. In spite of their so called reservations, they've had many threats from their membership about this. Many of their members are now leaving AARP for other Senior Organizations.

Obama is coming around to your way of thinking. He is too much like Martin Luther King... believing in working together and doing the right thing. Bipartisanship.

This has nothing to do with being nice and working together. You have to know that right. Its all down to Politics. If the Dems can't attract even one Republican supporter, then they'll own this bill. Outright in its entirety. And when it flops, as polls are showing an very strong majority opposed to it. More then elected Obama in fact, then it will Costs the Dems in next years election. If they pass this without Rep votes, many of them could well be looking for work next election. And Pelosi will probably have a new job, as Dem Minority Leader. Though she'll probably lose that after their defeat.

daydream - I'm still trying to grasp where the illegal immigrants will get their service that the GOP keeps crying about. < :-)

Whats being argued about here, is national insurance. Where everyone is insured by the government. This is of course funded by Taxpayers.
What people are saying is, that without adequate checks, illegals will be able to register in, and be a part of the system as well. Would be like getting medicare. You get it now right? Thats not so hard to understand.

Hmmmm, I think Rush Limbaugh is an alien. If you look at him when he's red faced and really going for his point his antennas just barely poke through. He's a bad man.

Though if you compare him to Obama, he looks like a Saint. You saw Obama with his little hitler mustache didn't you. (Sorry, with your crack about Limbaugh, you totally left yourself open for this.)
adaydream at 08:35 AM JST - 14th September

Molenir I said...

Where is the disconnect and where will they get their cards if we do our job? Where are they getting registered at? Unless you have a job and/or job related health insurance (you have to be an American citizen or legal immigrant to get a job) then people have to be buying their private insurance from insurance companies. Part of their process is gathering your SSN. No SSN or legal entrance then no insurance.

You go to the doctor with out some kind of insurance, they want "CASH" or you don't get service. Doctors aren't working for free. So at what point is the illegal immigrant getting his service?
adaydream at 08:44 AM JST - 14th September

If republicans are so scared that illegals will get these National Insurance Cards, then they should be just as worried that illegals are getting drivers licenses or enlisting in the military or voting as republicans.

Republicans can help in the process and work this out if they didn't whine so much.

I heard that over 100 republican suggestions have been incorporated in the health plan, but they just say "NO". < :-)
Molenir at 03:13 PM JST - 14th September

If republicans are so scared that illegals will get these National Insurance Cards, then they should be just as worried that illegals are getting drivers licenses or enlisting in the military or voting as republicans.

No illegal should be driving in the US, and it doesn't matter who they vote for, they shouldn't be voting, period. The same is true of convicted felons who have lost their right to vote. If you aren't a citizen, or aren't legally entitled to vote, then you shouldn't. And there should be mechanisms in place to ensure that only those who are legally eligible to do so, can do so.

I don't have a problem with these people enlisting in the military. Its a path to citizenship. Nor do I have a problem with people who stand in line, apply for a visa and a green card, and who work their way into the country legally. To me, following the path means they have earned their citizenship. Even more so then someone like myself who merely by virtue of having been born in the country received it. To me, those are the people who are truly Americans. I admire and respect those who struggled to come to American and earn their citizenship. I have no respect for someone who had themselves smuggled over the border. Sympathy yes, but respect no.

Republicans can help in the process and work this out if they didn't whine so much.

What process are you talking about specifically? When the Dems have yet to put forward any proposals worth considering, what is there to help with? What is there to negotiate about? Particularly when you consider that Dems have no need of Republican votes to pass whatever they want. Well, they do in the Senate for Cloture, but otherwise no. As for them incorporating Republican suggestions. Yes its true, that Republicans have been offering amendments to the various bills. If you know anything about the legislative process, you'd realize how common this is. However the ones amendments that would truly effect this legislation, and make it worth passing have all been defeated.

Where is the disconnect and where will they get their cards if we do our job? Where are they getting registered at? Unless you have a job and/or job related health insurance (you have to be an American citizen or legal immigrant to get a job) then people have to be buying their private insurance from insurance companies. Part of their process is gathering your SSN. No SSN or legal entrance then no insurance.

I'm not sure what you're saying here. The reason Obama was called a liar, was that illegals would be able to aquire coverage under all the bills currently. Although I believe they've since modified the Senate version to specifically prohibit this. And to have include checks to verify citizenship. The house bills do not require this, meaning that illegals would be getting coverage. The US taxpayer which already foots the bill for their emergency treatment would now have to cover all the treatments for these individuals. That is simply unacceptable. We'll have to see what if anything comes out of the conference committee if these bills manage to pass. But I suspect any provisions barring them would likely be stripped from the final bill.
AK619 at 08:33 AM JST - 15th September

Obama was called a Liar, because Rep. Joe Wilson is a typical selfish, greedy Republican fool! Federal money won't be given to illegal aliens for health care, it will be worded in the plan. Obama is the only President ever to make an effort to care about Americans health. Its a shame that America has went on this long, not caring for Americans health, while insurance companies got rich and dropped there clients from there plan because you needed a tooth pulled out or surgery. You had to sue the insurance companies many times to abide by there own policy rules to cover your health care cost. The health insurance and medical cost were so high, that I had to go to Mexico and get tooth surgery done for only $100 USD, it would've cost me $5000 in America to pull out an impacted tooth. Insurance companies will not cover these kinds of expensive cost without a fight, even when you've been paying them health care fees for many years. I'm tired of seeing people talk bad about Obama, when Bush drove the country into the ground with war and waste of billions of tax dollars. If it wasn't for Obama stepping in, the whole worlds economy would be wrecked accross the globe.
amerijap at 12:30 AM JST - 16th September

Rep. Joe Wilson is a typical selfish, greedy Republican fool!

Well, I'm not gonna say that, though I agree that his outburst at the speech is utterly disturbing and problematic. South Carolina is the state where people are strongly opposing to illegal immigration along with other Red States in the South.
seijichuudo9sha at 12:48 AM JST - 16th September

At the end of the day Wilson doesn't matter.Democrats have a super majority. It's time to use it. "Rahm" health care reform through. It won't kick in til 2013 anyways,so it can't hurt Obama's chances at reelection. And, only 12 percent of the stimulus has been spent thus far.The rest is being held in reserve so it can be lavished on districts where repubs might actually mount a challenge in the 2010 mid terms.Think about it:Super majority and taxpayer-funded, bottomless war chest. Unbeatable! What is Obama waiting for...
amerijap at 12:53 AM JST - 16th September

What do you think businesses will do? Do you think they'll keep paying for the insurance of their employees, when the government will do it for them? Obviously not.

Please explain why you think employees must drop their insurance plans in the first place when the government offers the public option. Insurance companies are very tactic and smarter than many people think. They know the government intervention will seriously affect their ordinary business, and that's why they employ several strategies to deflect the public intervention. The insurance companies will keep charging the insurance fees as usual from the individual employees or family, unless they get sick and have to take major surgeries in the future. You can trust the insurane companies to some extent, if you're enrolling in a family plan. But not sure about individual plan. And don't forget that the number of people are being laid off, and they're losing their employer's insurance because of it.
amerijap at 12:53 AM JST - 16th September

What do you think businesses will do? Do you think they'll keep paying for the insurance of their employees, when the government will do it for them? Obviously not.

Please explain why you think employees must drop their insurance plans in the first place when the government offers the public option. Insurance companies are very tactic and smarter than many people think. They know the government intervention will seriously affect their ordinary business, and that's why they employ several strategies to deflect the public intervention. The insurance companies will keep charging the insurance fees as usual from the individual employees or family, unless they get sick and have to take major surgeries in the future. You can trust the insurane companies to some extent, if you're enrolling in a family plan. But not sure about individual plan. And don't forget that the number of people are being laid off, and they're losing their employer's insurance because of it.
zurcronium at 09:22 AM JST - 18th September

the teabaggers and their puppet masters keep rattling on about immigrants, meanwhile 45,000 Americans die a year due to lack of health coverage. 45,000.

Nearly 45,000 people die in the United States each year -- one every 12 minutes -- in large part because they lack health insurance and can not get good care, Harvard Medical School researchers found in an analysis released on Thursday.

The republicans can spend $3 trillion to fight a failed war in Iraq but nothing to help 45,000 Americans a year that are dying cause insurance companies want to only make money.