U.S. soldier charged in comrades' deaths showed stress

Wednesday 13th May, 07:02 AM JST

The requested article has expired, and is no longer available. Any related articles, and user comments are shown below.

› Login to comment

Latest 15 of 32 Total Comments Show All

Alphaape at 01:07 PM JST - 13th May

and in this man's case there were a few, and all were related to the war.

smith: I think the jury is still out on that one. We don't know what he was facing back at home that may have pushed him over. I agree probably being away from home with problems back there can be trying at times, but I just don't think that it was all the war's fault. I will agree that it may have been a factor, but I put to you once we find out what was it that was eating at this guy, and if it comes out to be home issues, wheter he was in Iraq, or deployed to Ft. Irwin for exercises he probably would have snapped. But let's wait and see.

But no matter what, whether it was from home or war, this is tragic with the loss of life of innocents.
smithinjapan at 01:20 PM JST - 13th May

Alphaape: "But no matter what, whether it was from home or war, this is tragic with the loss of life of innocents."

Agreed on that point.
likeitis at 03:16 PM JST - 13th May

smithinjapan: Alphaape: Great first post.

I have to concur with that. It really hit a lot of points most of us could not have figured out on our own.
goodDonkey at 03:34 PM JST - 13th May

timorborder

I definitely enjoy hearing your point of view. It provides real insight. Your posts are a welcome addition to a thread like this. It is something JT should absolutely cherish; getting first hand knowledge. I feel bad for the families of those shot as well as the victims themselves.

I of course cannot speculate on this case because I do not know the facts; I probably never will. However, I have no problem stating that if an individual (military personnel) is in need of immediate mental care and is not properly assessed then a portion of the blame is systemic. That means that actions from improper care place a portion of the guilt on the military and in the end the U.S. government. Individuals cannot help it if they become mentally ill. It is then their responsibility to seek help. The burden then falls on him or her being honest about their conditions and if they have done their best then the rest of the responsibility is on the government. Detain someone who would hurt their self or others. But it is most important to provide immediate care.

I was in the Air Force but there is no way I could handle 3 tours of duty in a war zone at this time in my life. The stress would break me. I feel compassion for all those serving extended commitments but especially for those who do so involuntarily. We had laws that served as commitments to our military personnel and we changed those laws. I call that breaking a promise to those who initially received a different commitment than the new laws provided for. Furthermore I consider it irresponsible. If the cause is just we will have plenty of volunteers. The fact that we could not sustain proper rest periods and maintain a limited number of tours unless overridden by individual choice speaks volumes about the number of people who feel it is just and are willing to volunteer. It is my opinion we would have continued to have sufficient personnel to maintain action in Afghanistan, until we properly resolved that conflict, if action would have been limited to those responsible for attacking the U.S. and related terrorists or insurgents; whether state sponsored or outside political forces.

How could we treat our human resources like other procured assets? Our missions need to include valuing the men and women that are fighting as well as those they are fighting for. I still believe in actions in non-strategic missions; but only with a wide diversity of coalition forces. If we cannot get a wide diversity of coalition forces then I do not believe we should be engaged in non-strategic missions. That still leaves the possibility of engagement in Afghanistan with or without coalition support. We were attacked and I consider that a strategic mission.

When we forget our personnel are not just resources but human beings then we can expect that we will end up with a certain percentage of animal behavior to be an unintended consequence. I have been concerned about the stress our personnel have had to endure for quite some time. I view it as a separate issue than the justification of the war. Humanity demands that we respect those who fight to protect us.

Again my sympathy to the victims and their families.
bushlover at 06:54 PM JST - 13th May

[Keep it up -- you will someday contribute something valuable.]

Oh I come here to learn from the best of the know it alls. Thanks for lettin us know how it all is.
cow76 at 09:05 PM JST - 13th May

Why the big focus on whether he was unbalanced? Surely EVERY murderer is mentally unbalanced, whether permanently or just for a few seconds. If this guy doesn't get the death penalty then neither shoudl anyone else.
Taka313 at 10:02 PM JST - 13th May

Timorborder,

Some officials believe soldiers are reluctant to take advantage of the facilities because of the stigma attached to counseling in a military culture that promotes mental and physical toughness.

This is a key issue in all this. As somebody who has served in the military and who saw my fair share of combat, I can tell you that the emphasis on being tough gets stronger and stronger the closer you get to the front line. Moreover, individuals who cannot hack it in a combat unit are sometimes very reticent to come forward and seek help because of the strong underlying code of not deserting your fellow soldiers

You are absolutely right. However, the good news is, the Army is working VERY hard to change that paradigm.

Advances in medicine have allowed doctors to realize that TBI (traumatic brain injury) is a far bigger player than originally thought. Service members that would have been treated for depression and/or PTSD are now being screened for TBI and the advances that are being made are allowing doctors to remap parts of the brain so that brain functions that were once hindered because they ran through an injured part of the brain can now be re-routed, allowing for a better chance of recovery.

Anyway, the "Cowboy up" mentality, although certainly still very evident, is starting to go away.

Taka
Sarge at 10:37 PM JST - 13th May

"these people signed up to defend their country and not occupy a foreign country indefinitely"

These people signed up to obey orders, and by golly they're going to obey their orders, even if those orders are to serve a third tour in Iraq or Afghanistan. Serving in Iraq or Afghanistan is, by the way, defending our country. Didn't you know that?
adaydream at 11:10 PM JST - 13th May

Please Sarge

Serving in Iraq or Afghanistan is, by the way, defending our country. Didn't you know that?

Serving in Iraq has nothing to do with protecting this country. Iraq never had anything to do with protecting this country.

This country went into Iraq with an agenda to make george bush a war president. It did that. It also turned into a complete disaster for the United States, especially after there weren't any WMD, the reason for his attack.

Then it was determined that we never had enough troops to successfully do the task without over stretching the military, so it's 2, 3 and 4 tours of duty in a combat zone.

Sure it's their duty to do as ordered and the men and women have displayed courage that most posters here who post on JT have never been required to fulfill.

Numerous tours in Iraq and Afghanistan are killing our troops. Not the enemies bullets, ours.

Yeah Sarge they signed up to protect their country. But, there are limits to what they can do. < :-)
Sarge at 11:18 PM JST - 13th May

Please, adaydream - How could you have served in the military and not know that serving in Iraq, fighting the scumbags who would torture and kill you or me without hesitation or remorse, is indeed protecting this country?
adaydream at 11:26 PM JST - 13th May

Sarge, Iraq did nothing against this country. They didn't attack us.

Based on your assertion, why didn't we attack Saudi Arabia? The terrorists who attacked us came from SA, not Iraq.

But our troops are serving numerous tours in a country that did not make an aggressive act against us. < :-)
goodDonkey at 12:54 AM JST - 14th May

I heard on the news that 12% have mental/emotional problems after an initial tour in Iraq or Afghanistan. That number jumps to 27% after the third tour. That is a 156% increase or 2.25 times the initial rate. Sorry they did not provide a number for serving two tours. It is kind of clumsy providing the jump without an intermediate increased percentage.
goodDonkey at 01:02 AM JST - 14th May

Sarge said:

These people signed up to obey orders, and by golly they're going to obey their orders, even if those orders are to serve a third tour in Iraq or Afghanistan.

Sarge, that might carry some weight if you had been the one serving three tours. Talk is cheap. As for me I will be ignoring your comments and listening to those with extensive combat experience. They also appear to be intelligent, independent thinkers.
Sarge at 09:46 AM JST - 14th May

Donkey - If 27% have mental/emotional problems ater a third tour in Iraq or Afghanistan, why is President Obama keeping our soldiers in Iraq for another couple of years and escalating our involvement in Afganistan? Is he just being cruel?

"I will be ignoring your comments and listening to those with extensive combat experience"

How about that soldier who lost his leg in Iraq and supported McCain and Palin?
goodDonkey at 02:31 PM JST - 14th May

Sarge said: why is President Obama keeping our soldiers in Iraq for another couple of years and escalating our involvement in Afganistan [Afghanistan]? Is he just being cruel?

I hope he can rectify the situation. I will be watching. I don't have to agree with every thing he does to approve of his presidency. I do not want soldiers being forced to stay on past their enlistment period. I do not want soldiers serving three tours of duty without their consent. I expect Obama to correct this harsh treatment of our valuable personnel. The correct executive decision was to never enter Iraq. Even if it was justified (which it was not) it was not an eminent danger and we should have completely stabilized Afghanistan first! Are you telling me that you are proud of Bush's and the Republicans success in Afghanistan? I know for a fact that if we had put the 100,000 troops in Afghanistan that are now located in Iraq we would have a level of success that is unfathomably greater, by a factor not just a greater percentage, than we are experiencing today. If you are correct in saying that Iraq was justified, and I do continue to disagree with you on that, but even if you were correct the timing was wrong and has led to many unnecessary failures that diminish the overall war effort. The Neo-Con strategy was idiotic and our soldiers are paying the price. Obama must now make decisions based on the truth of the situation at hand. I think he has to continue the policy for the time being to get the best outcome possible from a terrible mistake by our government through the actions of the Republicans. I hope he can provide relief as soon as possible to our troops and begin practicing a more responsible policy for rotating our troops (length of tour), number of tours and forced service beyond the terms of the enlistment the military personnel agreed to. Bush screwed up all three of those things. Shame. Obama must continue to seek the best solutions for manning the effort as we back out of Iraq and increase the effort in Afghanistan.

I can't believe I have to say this one more time. Nobody in Iraq was responsible for the terrorist acts committed in the U.S. on 09.11.2001. The Neo-Con's efforts failed to deliver Ossama bin Laden as promised. The New-Con's efforts failed to stabilize Afghanistan sufficiently, which surely could have been all but completed by now with an additional 100,000 troops at the commanders disposal.

We should have completed the task of getting the terrorists responsible for the act on American soil. NO DIVERSIONS!

Sarge forced my hand, I had no intention of mentioning, explicitly, the underlying facts which cause Obama to continue the terrible practices of screwing our military personnel, for the short term, to protect our country's security. I had not intention of railing against Bush; I want to let go of the past. I have no problem letting Bush enjoy his retirement. So, emphatically no, Obama is not being cruel! Bush was cruel and has forced Obama's hand in the interest of national security. It is a damn shame but so are the the trillions of dollars we must spend to correct the errors of the Republicans.

It is very costly to fix the massive dammage the Republicans have done in America; both in human costs and monetary costs.

As far as the soldier who lost his leg in Iraq that supported the Republican executive choices; there were such examples supporting both sets of candidates. Are we to add them up in two columns to decide the presidency? That was a ludicrous question that does not deserve entertaining a serious response.