Venezuela gets $2.2 bil in credit for Russian arms
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0
Molenir
lol. So very funny. If the US wanted to attack Venezuela, there is nothing and nobody in the world that could stop them. That they haven't bothered to is more an indication of just how serious a threat Venezuela is. Chavez is talking tough against his neighbors, but what this is really for, is to enable him to take the final step towards becoming dictator for life. It will enable him to finally and totally clamp down on his opposition in the country. Any who don't like it won't stand a chance.
0
rajakumar
Russia and Venezuela up business in arms/defense/weapons by 2200 million.
France was also going to have some weapons/aircrafts deals in Brazil too.
Arms business sales up as usual for the aristocrats in South America.
0
adaydream
Hmm, what's it called when the US goes and borrows money from China and then goes and gives it to Israel?
So Venezuela gets a credit line, they have to pay it back. Israel never pays it back, the US pays China back.
Then when you look at $2.2Billion in arms. That ain't squat. The US needs to be as concerned about Venezuela as much as Iran attacking Israel.
Big deal. < :-)
0
lostrune2
Venezuela is wasting its money.
Also, the US ain't paying China back.
0
adaydream
We will have to some day.
Venezuela will probably pay their loan back before we pay back ours loans. < :-)
0
Molenir
Umm, I agree that the US has no need to worry about Venezuela, I think Israel have a great deal to worry about with regards to Iran. With them building longer ranged missles, developing nukes, and stating repeatedly they think Israel should be destroyed...
Thus demonstrating a total and complete lack of understanding regarding how the financial markets work. Yes, the US is paying China back. They're paying back anyone who has purchased part of the US debt. Hence the interest payments you see as part of the Budget every single year. Payments that are now eating up more and more of the budget. If, the US balanced their budget. I mean not spending a nickel more then they took in, and not saving a nickel more then they took in, in 30 years, the debt would be entirely paid off. Really. Its a bit more complicated then that, but its essentially how things work.
0
lostrune2
Molenir,
Paying interest ain't paying debts back. (Although technically, it could get to a point that total interest payments exceed the original debt, then that just becomes a stupid situation.)
China is already getting nervous about buying even more US Treasury bonds that they already have because, to them it looks more and more like a sunk financial cost, save for some political leverage. They don't think they'll get most of that money back, or at least any foreseeable future time (the Chinese Communist Party may not even be around.)
Of course the US always plans on paying its debts back, and yet the debt just keeps on piling. The actual paying-back lasted just a few good years under the Clinton administration, but that plan expected the good times to roll for a long long time. That's too much to expect - stuff happens, then the economic downturn. So the US has to borrow again and lower taxes to stimulate the economy. But nobody wants to raise taxes back up when the economic cycle goes back up again but rather use the excess money for other pet projects, so they end up paying back less than they borrowed during the bad times, and the debt gets passed on to the next generations. The US debt is in the trillion$$ now. There's no incentive to pay it back soon since the US is in the position of power that keeps the global economy stable. Current reality is the US can just keep putting it off.
0
seijichuudo9sha
After all Obama has done for Chavez he goes and does this? This really makes me wonder about things.
0
lostrune2
I'm sure the US can certainly pay back its debt in 30 years - if there is intent to pay it back in 30 years. But like I said, stuffs happen plus there's no incentive, and the US can afford to keep putting it off. Maybe in 300 years, if the US as-is is still around or China (and other lender nations) decays (Americans could wish), whichever comes first.
0
skipthesong
well aday, if Israel ain't got no need to worry about Iran getting their hands on more destructive weapons, why worry about me carrying a gun?
Look giving Chevez more dangerous toys does not make Latin America any safer. I can't believe a left leaning person like you applauds countries for getting more weapons.. its so ironic.
Where's smith on this?
0
seijichuudo9sha
Am I the only progressive here who will denounce this crazy arms build up? What is Chavez trying to do?Closing down TV stations isn't helping either.
0
seijichuudo9sha
2 billion worth of shiny new Russian armaments is not exactly peanuts.Doesn't Chavez get it? This will hurt Obama.Already the wingers are all over this.They're saying this proves what they claimed - Obama looks weak, he apologizes for America's past and it simply invites aggression,and a renewed Russian presence in the Western hemisphere.Dammit all, It's back to 79 and comparisons to Carter.
0
SuperLib
Odd choice of words...."country's." Chavez seized Venezuela's oils fields for himself a long time ago.
0
skipthesong
Chavez seized Venezuela's oils fields for himself a long time ago." Slaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaam dunk!
0
smithinjapan
skipthesong: "Where's smith on this?"
Sigh... why must you always try to tie in and rant about domestic gun control laws when talking about international arms sales? They are not at all related, aside from having weapons as the ONLY commonality. Or wait... did you buy your gun, skip, from the Russians to protect from US invasion? Come on, bud. As I've said several times now, leave the baggage at the door.
But hey, I WILL tell you that I am against this sale, not because I think it poses any threat to the US, but because of what Molenir said (and I actually agree with) -- Chavez is just cementing his position as dictator and obtaining more means to do it by force. What's more, it sickens me that Russia, the US, France, or whomever will simply sell arms to ANYONE who is willing to take out the credit or pay in cash (in this case, of course, it's Russia).
"Look giving Chevez more dangerous toys does not make Latin America any safer. I can't believe a left leaning person like you applauds countries for getting more weapons.. its so ironic."
As well as asking you to leave you're baggage at the door numerous times, I've asked you again and again NOT to project or misdirect your weird allusions onto others. NOWHERE did adaydream 'applaud' a country for getting more weapons..... or can you prove that he did?
Seriously, skip.
Molenir: Aside from the 'If the US wants to invade there's nothing anyone can do' bit I agree with you (the military is too stretched out and it literally could NOT invade and would face catastrophic results if it did... regardless of wanting to or not).
0
adaydream
skipthesong
I haven't applauded anything. It's a rationalization of understanding and putting things into perspective.
I don't see where we have anything to worry about and countries are allowed to buy arms to protect themselves. < :-)
0
grafton
Chavez said “Venezuela doesn’t plan to invade anybody,” I think that that is more or less what Hitler said about Germany in 1938/9.
There are a few assumptions above that the US wouldn’t attack Venezuela & Venezuela wouldn’t attack the US, but there are no assumptions that Venezuela wouldn’t attack Colombia & if they did just how is the US going to avoid getting dragged into that horrible mess? Say, “Sorry, we are busy at the moment can you call back later?”
As for the US debt, don`t we all feel so secure knowing that the US is in debt up to its bald headed eagle while the rest of the world pays for everything with a this years bubble dollar?
0
adaydream
grafton
I bet that's what a lot of countries said about the US before george bush attacked Iraq. In that context, there might be some validity to your comment. But I don't think so. < :-)
0
ca1ic0cat
Chavez is just using the US as a scapegoat to justify his dictatorial and agressive actions. He's threatened to invade Columbia and Guatemala, so his saying that he is no threat to anybody is bull. He has also been giving weapons to the FARC terrorists so I imagine that they will be getting some of this hardware as well.
Chavez is destabilizing the region. But he's no threat to the US - except, maybe, in his own mind.
It does reflect badly on Russia that they would contribute to this. I wonder what they think they are up to? Oh well, maybe the first Iranian nuke the terrorists get will go off in Moscow.
0
Molenir
You're misunderstanding how the bond markets work. When you're talking a 30 year T Bill, in 30 years, the bond matures and is paid off. If theres a deficit, the bill is paid off via more bonds, otherwise its merely paid off as part of the budget. Think of it like a credit card. If you make your payments every month, and don't add any additional debt on your card, in x amount of time, you will have paid off the card. The debt works the same way. Thats one reason why we have been able to keep deficit spending for so long. And why these countries are all so willing to purchase American debt. Because its been a solid investment. You buy the debt, the bond, and 30 years later, you get your money back, plus. The more in debt we go however, the harder it is to look and see the US paying this back. The interest payments on this years debt for example is going to be staggering.
Getting back to the topic at hand. I do admit to a bit of concern about Venezuela developing Nuclear power. Not a great deal of concern, but some even still. Going nuclear is a good investment any way you look at it. Its more energy efficient, produces more power for less waste, with minimal risks of contamination. But it carries with it the weapons potential. I doubt Venezuela even under Dictator for Life Chavez will go that route, but it is a bit of a concern.
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