Thursday February 16, 2012

SwissToni's past comments

  • -2

    SwissToni

    Davidattokyo, 'The reason that anti-whalers look at it from this perspective is because they wish to believe that there is a permanent ban on whaling'.

    Wellnthere you go agin trying to give people a simple label. It's not like that. Anti whalers, like those that support it, have multiple reasons to continue those battle. Yours and Ossanamerica's seems to he the legality, never mind the morality. Keep clouding the issue, I'm sure you think it helps.

    Posted in: U.S., Australia, NZ 'disappointed' over Japan whale hunt

  • -2

    SwissToni

    'Why does not Japan then reverse it's stance and start a commercial hunt?'

    Because the Japanese whalers have spent many years trying and failing to win the moral high ground. Such an obvious change of tack would be like admitting defeat.

    Posted in: U.S., Australia, NZ 'disappointed' over Japan whale hunt

  • -2

    SwissToni

    Davidattokyo, Ossanamerica, say what you will to cloud the issue, you cant make a silk purse out of a sows ear. The Japanese whalers arguments have been demonstrated as a ploy to continue commercial whaling. Stop beating about the bush it's BS. In truth theyre always going to be vilified as long as they are in conflict with others wishes. Win or lose the ICJ case, or the suit in the US. Whaling is a popular passtime in whaling circles only.

    Posted in: U.S., Australia, NZ 'disappointed' over Japan whale hunt

  • 0

    SwissToni

    Dotobock, 'Can someone tell me why Japan can't hunt commercial where as Norway and Iceland can? Thank you. I'd like to know what the difference in commercial and scientific is'.

    Japan agreed to the moratorium on commercial whaling. Norway and Iceland didnt.

    As for the difference between commercial and scientific whaling. Well one is conducted simply for commercial reasons. The other is conducted simply to gather data. The clause in the IWC regulations requiring whales not be wasted is Japan's whalers 'get out of jail free' card. The issue of Japans whalers true motives is to be aired at the ICJ soon.

    Posted in: U.S., Australia, NZ 'disappointed' over Japan whale hunt

  • -1

    SwissToni

    Ossanamerica, 'The closest Japan came to ceasing it's completely legal research whaling was when the IWC offered a compromise in 2010 to break the gridlock'

    Yes, by offering a commercial catch quota. Japan was full on for the idea and insisted on inclusion of a Southern Ocean catch. That certainly adds credence to the argument that Japan is currently only whaling for research purposes.

    Posted in: U.S., Australia, NZ 'disappointed' over Japan whale hunt

  • -1

    SwissToni

    Woodfords right the Olympus management is being naive. Tie ups require you spread your resources with the partner. Who would spread their cash with Olympus unless a company with a lot of spare cash? Any company with so much spare cash in a poor trading environment will just want to take the good parts and dump the rest.

    Posted in: Woodford wants to clean up Olympus management for good

  • -2

    SwissToni

    Dotobock, 'Does it mean that if whales were farmed it would be OK?'

    If you could selectively breed out their wanderlust, social systems and communication skills, provide them with pens large enough for free movement, feeding diving and all their other basic needs as well as finding a humane killer, why not? How realistic do you think that is though?

    'DUe to technology more and more whales do die straight away.'

    The grenade harpoon has barely changed since its inception in the late 1800s. It requires a great deal of skill to get a clean kill, accuracy in shooting a moving animal from a moving platform is parlous. Secondary killing methods continue to be required to this day because of the harpoon lack of efficiency.

    Dont be fooled, whalers cannot predict where a whale will breach. But once they see a pod they chase them down exhausting the animals and removing their capacity to dive for any great period. Only once the whale has been drawn into range can they be harpooned. Its not a nice way to kill an animal.

    Posted in: U.S., Australia, NZ 'disappointed' over Japan whale hunt

  • -1

    SwissToni

    'Ask yourself this question. Why is Japan doing scientific research?'

    I believe thats because the US recanted on fishing rights agreed following Japans acquiescence to the moratorium. It may be a good reason for Japan to be miffed, but that doesnt make the 'research' excuse any more valid. Yes, the loophole exists, and so technically it may be legal but that does not make it right. The Japanese whalers have demonstrably swapped one quota for another for commercial reasons.

    There are plenty of cases where civilians have 'broken' laws when demonstrating against moral issues. Sometimes it is the last resort to shock authorities into action. I hope nothing goes wrong at this years hunt. But ,taking account of the strength of feeling in both the Whalers and Sea Shepherds camps, luck cant last forever. Introducing the military wont help.

    Posted in: U.S., Australia, NZ 'disappointed' over Japan whale hunt

  • -1

    SwissToni

    One thing remains clear, these four nations publicly oppose Japans whaling programme. Wonder how this will affect Japans civil case against SS in the US? There are planty of examples where public oppinion can sway a court decision. This is especially so as no Sea Shepherd activist has been charged and convicted of any form of terrorism no matter what tag their opponents love label them with.

    Posted in: U.S., Australia, NZ 'disappointed' over Japan whale hunt

  • -2

    SwissToni

    It's mighty big of you to leave people to make their own decisions.

    The 1930s whaling convention is relevant as it puts the ongoing question of trust in context. Whaling, like religion or politics is a polarising issue. People should get as much information as they can from a variety of sources. I'm glad we both now agree on that. You've made some progress today, give yourself a pat on the back.

    Posted in: Japan whaling authorities sue Sea Shepherd in U.S.

  • -2

    SwissToni

    Davidattokyo, I dont make any excuses. Dotobock asked why people are against whaling and he got a list of some of the reasons. The abundance or otherwise of Minke is irrelevant to me as my own abhorrence of whaling is the killing method. Explain the humane killer you indicated the whalers have.

    'The Whaling Commission didn't even exist in the 1930's

    That's true, and as usual when manufacturing doubt, only a part of the story. The IWC is but the latest instrument to fail to manage the whaling industry. As you know the first Geneva Convention on whale conservation was introduced in the 1930s and promptly ignored by Japan.

    Posted in: Japan whaling authorities sue Sea Shepherd in U.S.

  • -2

    SwissToni

    Dotobok, 'Why is it that western English speaking countries with a meat based diet oppose Japanese sustainable hunt? You and I know the reasons are not scientific nor ecological.'

    I dont know that at all. I know its not simply western English speaking nations opposed to Japans hunt in the Southern Ocean. I know there is no way to humanely kill a whale. I know many species are endangered. I know the best population figures anyone can come up with have an error margin of +-50%. I know its not just Japan that has pressure applied to it. I know Japan has been fighting whale conservation measures since the 1930s. All of those reasons and many more are measurable and therefore scientific.

    I've seen no measure for 'Culture Imperialism' nor anti-whaling for reasons of whale as god, applied by Japan. Mostly because I think even the ICR with its woolly science would have trouble measuring that and not looking silly.

    "Are you Swiss btw?"

    Why, does it make my opinion any less valid?

    Posted in: Japan whaling authorities sue Sea Shepherd in U.S.

  • -1

    SwissToni

    Dotobok, you cant complain that the IWC has been hijacked by anti-whalers when the Japanese government spent years recruiting non whaling nations and paying their subscriptions (amongst other things) in order to gain voting influence. On levels of hijacking the IWC, Japan has been weighed and measured and found to be quite the lard arse.

    "I don't think fish farms is all that good for the environment. "

    Then you need to gather your friends and subscribe to the Greenpeace and Sea Shepherd protests in Norway and other countries where this is quite an issue.

    " I think farms in general are less eco friendly than hunting wild animals or fish in a sustainable manner. "
    With 7 billion people on the planet, you genuinely think this is a realistic option?

    "The pseudo science is believing that whales are not a apart of the eco system because of religious reasons."

    Well, if anyone had presented any scientic evidence to suggest a religious link, it would be pseudo science, but no-one has. This is just your made up issue, along with 'Culture Imperialism'. Theyre dead end arguments for you.

    Davidattokyo, please explain the humane killer available to the whaling industry.

    Posted in: Japan whaling authorities sue Sea Shepherd in U.S.

  • -2

    SwissToni

    'Lawyers are the winners in cases where money is the issue'

    It's a civil case, whichever way it goes, the lawyers get paid and the longer it goes on the better they like it. The publicity for Sea Shepherd will be greatly appreciated. I imagine donations will skyrocket.

    Posted in: Japan whaling authorities sue Sea Shepherd in U.S.

  • 0

    SwissToni

    Dotobok, so krill are in danger of extinction by whales eh? Are you advocating a whale cull so that krill can have a chance to multiply?

    Krill are a shrinking resource due to the rise in sea temperatures and reduced sea ice. Norway has shops capable of hauling 120,000 tons of krill in a season for fish farms. It isn't the whales increasing competition it's man. Drop the pseudo science and get some perspective.

    The only winners of the court case in the US will be the lawyers. Wouldn't it have been better to use the funds to research a humane killer to take any whales that may now be sustainably taken?

    Posted in: Japan whaling authorities sue Sea Shepherd in U.S.

  • 0

    SwissToni

    It's shame so many get killed, but considering the numbers of passengers, it still makes the trains an incredibly safe method of transport.

    Like all of us the train companies have limited resources and have to target the safety budget where it will be most effective. Just putting up barriers everywhere will cost us all (we're paying remember) a fortune. Barriers are going up at higher risk stations first and others later. I'm sure some stations won't warrant the expense. Some platforms, particularly on the older lines won't be large enough. I think people sometimes forget we all have a responsibility to look after ourselves when we're out and about. Getting a little less drunk, or being aware of our surroundings will hugely mitigate the risk.

    Posted in: Transport Ministry says 2011 worst on record for passengers falling onto train tracks

  • 1

    SwissToni

    Davidattokyo, one thing we can agree on, manufactured doubt plays a large part in the whaling debate. Having seen your personal campaign against anti whaling leveraging legal loopholes, pseudo science, bluster and peoples natural feelings of victimisation, theres a big fat check right next to you. I'll let people make up their own minds who does what.

    You ask what I have against whale meat? Nothing. However, companies aren't purchasing whalemeat to store, they purchase it to sell. The lack of market forces whale to be stored for long periods. Many japanese people may express an interest in eating whale but few translate that into an actual purchase. When the freshly hunted whale meat arrives following the arbitrary hunt, there's no choice but to stockpile. Of course it's a seasonal product some level of stockpiling is inevitable, but you get a healthy throughput of sold product and new stock. Unfortunately, even following reduced catches, whale meat stockpiles continue to rise. Pretty good evidence of a lack of market and good evidence that the $30 million would be better spent supporting those who really need it. Retraining for new jobs where old ones were swept away in the disaster maybe?

    Posted in: Japan using quake disaster budget for whaling aid

  • -2

    SwissToni

    Senseiman, "Somehow I feel that every post you have written here is part of it."

    I read an interesting article on the Manufactured Doubt industry. It was specifically talking about the defence of the tobacco industry and the attacks on environmentalism and climate change by professional lobbyists and public relations businesses. It referred to a package of measures taken in defending a particular perspective, essentially to buy time.

    These are: - Launch a public relations campaign disputing the evidence. - Predict dire economic consequences, and ignore the cost benefits. - Use non-peer reviewed scientific publications or industry-funded scientists who don't publish original peer-reviewed scientific work to support your point of view. - Trumpet discredited scientific studies and myths supporting your point of view as scientific fact. - Point to the substantial scientific uncertainty, and the certainty of economic loss if immediate action is taken. - Use data from a local area to support your views, and ignore the global evidence. - Disparage scientists, saying they are playing up uncertain predictions of doom in order to get research funding. - Disparage environmentalists, claiming they are hyping environmental problems in order to further their ideological goals. - Complain that it is unfair to require regulatory action, as it would create an economic disadvantage compared to elsewhere. - Claim that more research is needed before action should be taken.

    Recognise any of this in the whaling debate?

    Davidattokyo basks in the glow of survey findings that indicate there are millions of people in Japan "deeply interested" in eating whales. Sometimes surveys simply don't bear out the facts. They cant be that interested, the fact is stockpiles of whale meat continue increasing year on year.

    The $30 million would be much better spent extending the unemployment benefits of those (many more) people that still languish homeless and unemployed rather than recycling it back into the state via the Coast Guard.

    Posted in: Japan using quake disaster budget for whaling aid

  • -1

    SwissToni

    No davidattokyo, but the act of chasing down an animal and killing it slowly and painfully is.

    Posted in: Whaling fleet off to Antarctica with beefed up security measures

  • 2

    SwissToni

    This is a disgrace. Shame on the the few who benefit from these funds. There are peoe rejected benefits and this Monet is assigned to this shameful practice. It's disrespectful to those who continue to suffer.

    Posted in: Japan using quake disaster budget for whaling aid

Follow us

Facebook
Twitter

View all