JAPAN NEWS AND DISCUSSION
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- Full-time English Teacher - Osaka
- Epion English Language Schools, Osaka
- Salary: ¥200,000 ~ ¥250,000 / Month Depending on your ability and experience
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- Epion English Language Schools, Osaka
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- Core Developer - コアディベロッパー
- Midokura Japan K.K. - ミドクラジャパン株式会社, Tokyo
- Salary: ¥4.0M ~ ¥10.0M / Year Negotiable
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davidattokyo
Spidapig24,
Sustainable use is environmentalism.
Unsustainable use and no-use are both extremist ideas and are best avoided in the real world of which we humans are a part.
Plenty enough for a modest, conservative, sustainable harvest. It's extremist to say that zero whales is the only appropriate catch limit.
They signed up to the convention, and later some members went feral and illegally proclaimed a sanctuary, to which Japan lodged an objection under Article V.3. So no, it doesn't stop them
Japan is not violating CITES either. Geez you gotta read the rules before making these wild allegations.
But that'd mean there would be no supply until the next harvest is brought it.
That's hardly good management, is it?
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
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davidattokyo
troyinjapan,
Unfortunately, that is a good summary of my general impression.
Well there are some things about whaling that non-anti-whalers do know better than anti-whalers. This isn't really surprising, as anti-whalers have no interest in learning about how non-anti-whalers thing.
But please note that whalers have in the past - up to the 1970's - failed to appropriately conduct their whaling operations.
This is why I believe it is important that the IWC (or replacement organization) fulfil the mandate laid out under the whaling convention.
Think of it like this: One extreme: All-out unregulated, unsustainable whaling. Another extreme: No whaling at all
I am moderate - I support regulated, sustainable whaling. I don't see it's all that bad...
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
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davidattokyo
Spidapig24,
You don't seem to get it. The whaling rules were decided before any nation was a member of the IWC. Subsequently nations (like Japan) that agree with the rules can sign up. And any nation that is a member of the IWC but then suddenly does not like the rules has the right to quit the organization, so as to no longer be bound by the agreed rules.
Australia should exercise it's rights and leave if it doesn't like the rules. That is the only honourable action (instead they are going to shame themselves with a ridiculous case at the ICJ, talking about losing face).
The whaling convention is not a loophole. The whaling convention IS the rules. You are backwards talking about something written explicitly into the convention being a "loophole". By definition the convention is not a loophole.
It has other rights under the convention which it exercised and is thus not bound by the illegally adopted sanctuary as a result. What don't you understand about that?
False, the Japanese are not the only ones who believe it isn't. Why does the anti-whaling rhetoric always try to make out that Japan is isolated when that is anything but the truth?
Sure, and I am also familiar with the Article 5.2 and 5.3 as well. If you were too, you'd understand why Japan is not acting illegally, and also why the "sanctuary" was illegal. Article 5.2 and 5.3 states the conditionality that applies to 5.1. Now do you understand?
LOL, check your facts. Before the "moratorium" minke whale catch quotas each year were around 5,000. Now unless you think 5,000 is very close to what Japan takes under research permit (850) then you are wrong.
If it were commercial whaling in disguise they'd be hunting at least 2,000 a year. They aren't, smell the coffee?
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
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davidattokyo
smithinjapan,
I don't need to show you anything. The rules are clearly stated in the whaling convention.
Australia etc could quite the whalers commission if they don't like the rules and no longer wish to be associated with the legitimisation of various whaling nations' activities.
Everyone who understands and accepts the whaling convention can see that it is.
Sheez we go with "the world" statements again... Anti-whaling arrogance is never ending.
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
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davidattokyo
Spidapig,
Woke up? They went crazy, that's what happened. No need for everyone else to jump off a bridge just because crazy Aussies decided to.
Aussies don't make the rules by themselves.
Rules are made by agreement. Japan for one never agreed that the whaling commission shouldn't be a whaling commission. Simple stuff no?
Don't like it? Take your toys and go home, this is the international community we are talking about.
Australia is representative of the civilised world?
Illegally, it did so, yes. Japan exercised it's right under the whaling convetion to not be bound by this illegal sanctuary. What don't you understand about that?
What don't you understand about Article VIII? Haven't you already had it explained to you?
Even when you have the same information as me you tend to look at it through the blinkers...
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
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davidattokyo
Spidapig24,
I haven't looked at the JWA page in yonks but according to you it says there is "low demand" for whale products, huh?
I guess you are joking... If not show me a URL.
I don't give a hoot about the JWA website any more than I give a hoot about the Greenpeace website.
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
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davidattokyo
Spidapig24,
Ridiculous, Japan joined as soon as it could after world war two.
Australia itself was busy hunting whales until 25 years after that.
Give it up already, you are putting the anti-whaling side of the argument to shame!!
Japan is following the rules of the whaling convention to a tee. What don't you understand about the "WHALING" in "International Whaling Commission"????
Sounds more like Australia bitching and moaning about it's stoopid Antarctic claims which no one takes seriously - even Australian government officials themselves.
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
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davidattokyo
steve@CPFC,
Ummm well gee, the schools and hospitals decide to put whale on their menus and buy the stuff...
Like any other day of the week...
Really you are grasping at straws with this stuff. Whale is just another type of food, get over it.
Wrong - once the food is in the market place it is up to the market participants to decide what to do with it. They wouldn't be storing it if there was not demand proportinate to the costs of storing it.
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
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davidattokyo
Spidapig24,
That's not a "solution".
Japan has the legal right as does every nation party to UNCLOS to harvest marine resources on the high seas in accordance with their treaty obligations.
Japan is doing this.
Australians are just playing double-standards.
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
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davidattokyo
Spidapig24,
Legal under the whaling convention - you don't know what you're talking about.
No they aren't.
Illegal?
Illegal?
No they don't they use LRADs in response to violent eco-terrorist actions.
That's not illegal either.
You are just calling all sorts of stuff that you don't like "illegal".
Legality is NOT determined by whether YOU like something or not. Understand?
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
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davidattokyo
Spidapig24,
No I think Australians should be properly educated about the international agreements their nation has adhered to, that is a solution to the problem.
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
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davidattokyo
Spidapig24,
Well gee, if Australia had a problem with nations hunting whales in those international waters, why did they agree to join the whaling commission that legitimises the rights of nations to hunt whales there? Hmmm?
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
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davidattokyo
steve@CPFC,
How much is made into pet food huh steve? Got any facts?
So? If Schools and hospitals choose to buy it, it seems to go against your argument...
Massive amounts? Facts please steve, facts. How much? And can you put the amount in storage into context?
I kind guess you aren't paying a lot of them...
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
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davidattokyo
Australia doesn't own international waters.
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
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davidattokyo
That's a silly comparison. Before the "ban" (wasn't it supposed to be a temporary "moratorium"? hello..) it was possible to obtain biological samples from the commercial catches. So no need to separately catch whales to get even more biological samples.
The "ban" however precluded such collection of biological data - which the convention itself acknowledges is indispensible for the commission's work. So the only way left to get the data because of the "ban" (which was against the spirit of the whaling convetion) was to get it through special permit research whaling.
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
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davidattokyo
Spidapig24,
They aren't going to lose. Read the Wikileaks - even Australian government officials think their case has little chance of success at the ICJ, it was just a big PR stunt to try to salvage Kevin Rudd's popularity.
The US called it an "uncertain gamble with whales' lives". NZ warned against it too.
I think it's going to be the Australians who will ignore the judgement, because they are the ones who aren't going to like it.
How come you find it so hard to believe that the Japanese have the law on their side?
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
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davidattokyo
Spidapig,
They DO have a right. Read the convention!! Or do I have to teach you everything?
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
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davidattokyo
steve@CPFC,
Would you keep a product in storage if there was low demand for it - e.g. if you didn't think you could sell it?
That doesn't make sense to me, so I gotta question your "facts".
Like I said, if you want whaling to stand on it's own two feet then you ought to be with me in thinking the whaling commission should do it's job and regulate commercial whaling, rather than fail miserably to fulfil it's mandate. They don't call it a whaling commission for nothing...
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
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davidattokyo
steve@CPFC,
Unfortunately the needless "moratorium" imposed by the anti-whalers through devious means at the whaling commission precludes Japan from conducting whaling business (except for certain species not covered by the IWC).
It's not Japan that decided to impose a moratorium which forced Japan into research whaling to obtain data to help push the aims of the whaling convention.
If you are arguing for the moratorium to be lifted so that it can once again be a normal business and employ more people and make a greater contribution to society generally, then you're with me I take it?
Stored for years? Proof? If you want to try to show me a proof, then please be sure to include first-hand data, not data crunched through the commercial anti-whaling corporations' BS factories.
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling
2
davidattokyo
troyinjapan,
Hey, I don't have any figures about Japan (although I do know Japan has the world's strongest currency right now, if that counts for anything), but I do remember well that when Iceland was threatened with tourism boycotts after they resumed commercial whaling, their tourist numbers actually went UP, not down that year.
You know why?
Because most people don't care about whaling. It has negligible effects. People who want to go to Iceland are not your typical sofa-spuds wringing their hands about people eating some different type of animal. (The tourism boost to Iceland at that period was probably because their currency weakened relative to the Euro, nothing to do with whaling at all - indeed it's well known that tourists in Iceland often eat whale meat themselves!)
It's got to the point that the anti-whalers are begging whale-eating tourists to change their behaviour: http://www.politics.co.uk/opinion-formers/international-fund-for-animal-welfare-ifaw/article/ifaw-new-campaign-urges-tourists-visiting-iceland-to-avoid-e
So unless you can show me why we should believe that some boycotts will have an effect all of a sudden, after years and years of ongoing whaling, then I'm sorry but I, Do, Not, Believe, You.
Posted in: NZ, Australia condemn Japan's plan to go ahead with whaling