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Republican Asia experts say Trump presidency would be 'ruinous'

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Doesn't this actually help Trump? My impression, sitting here in Tokyo, is that Trump supporters are very anti-establishment, so when the establishment, like these poeple, lashes out at Trump, they are only made more confident in Trump and support him more strongly.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

"They said the Republican nominee offered “only bluster or preposterous panaceas” for Asia.."

Not just Asia folks.

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...and these so called Asian experts have failed to realize that China has already assumed global leadership while keeping low profile.

-9 ( +2 / -11 )

"Doesn't this actually help Trump?"

gokai: It only "helps" Trump with people who support him and will NEVER change their mind, regardless of what he says. Meanwhile, anyone who is on the fence,such as Republicans and Independents, are vowing not to vote for him.

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some14someAug. 17, 2016 - 07:45AM JST ...and these so called Asian experts have failed to realize that China has already assumed global leadership while >keeping low profile.

Leadership comes when nations follow a country willingly. Not by force, coercion or simply being bought out. Nations want to be like the leader. Who wants to be a totalitarian dictatorship that locks up it's own citizens for political reasons? Nations that are seen as leaders don't refuse to recognize international law and it's institutions. Nor do they constantly beat their chest yelling "war" all the time. No, China is more akin to the guano on Scarborough Shoal than a global leader.

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China has already assumed global leadership while keeping low profile.

That is an oxymoron.,

Anyways, yeah, this ain't news. News would be if any foreign policy expert in any area on this planet were to come out in support of the Angry Yam.

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gokai: It only "helps" Trump with people who support him and will NEVER change their mind,

I agree. I've tended to typecast the Trump cult into a single ruck, which I know is wrong. One of the subsets of the dozens of millions of Trump followers is made up of people who want his presidency to be ruinous. These include the nihilists and terminally bitter folks who, in the words of that once popular British band, 'want to destroy'. They have zero idea what to replace the current system (which I freely admit is seriously flawed) with, but don't care. The US Americans among them want to see a repeat of Iraq taken: blow it up and let someone else sort out the mess.

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@paulinusa - I am an independent in Japan and I would never vote for Trump, however I do not like Clinton either so where does that leave us in the middle? Probably go with one of the other candidates, or in my case I may even write in Jim Webb, as that is who I really liked from the start.

Barring any radical issues coming up about Ms. Clinton I think this one is election is over.

Mr. Townsend; I do not think people really want Trump's presidency to be ruinous - I just think there is a subset which has become so disconnected from and disgusted by the system they turn a blind eye to Trump's quite obvious shortcomings.....and this is a dangerous thing.

Personally I do not like Trump and I am quite certain he is not fit for office. However I see no one (perhaps with the exception of Bernie Sanders and the long out of the race Jim Webb) that will really do anything to address the radically growing wealth gap and destruction of the middle class. As the great British Band also said.......

.....Then I'll get on my knees and pray We don't get fooled again Don't get fooled again No, no!

Meet the new boss Same as the old boss....

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Republican Asia experts say Trump presidency would be 'ruinous'

What's ruinous is the TPP. What's ruinous is 4 more years of Obama.

Meet the new boss Same as the old boss....

Thanks Tokyo Engr. Perfect quote there. . . The Who.

-9 ( +2 / -11 )

@Tokyo-Engr I do not think people really want Trump's presidency to be ruinous

JT posters have in fact written they want the 'system' taken down and have said they don't care what replaces it.

Like you (and me), they want to see the wealth gap closed, but have offered no alternatives. The 'Small is Beautiful' model is one possible pole, but how realistic is that? Somewhere between that and the current state (literally?) of multinational corporatocracy makes sense, but I haven't heard anyone say how to get there, or say which leader can help steer us to a hopefully better place. (B Sanders perhaps?)

I certainly don't want the 'system' broken without a clear sense of what will replace it. I enjoy being a locavore, but I also like Amazon.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

What's ruinous is 4 more years of Obama.

Over 50% of Americans disagree with you according to polls. The only thing holding him back from a third term is the fact that he is not allowed to run for it. Otherwise all this Don the Con posturing would be irrelevant. Just think, if D the C has been able to keep his polling numbers this close to Hillary, whom the Republicans have managed to smear so bad that a large portion of the American population actually believes them, then just imagine how poorly he'd be doing against Obama, whom over half the Americans see favorably.

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China edging out Japan as No. 2 could have been fantasizing to be No. 1 and I don't think it is done silently. With Mr. Trump on your side of the planet and Mr. Duterte on our side of the planet, ruinous is such a kind word!

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Wouldn't be surprised if Trump surprised everyone and pulled out of the race near the end if he knows he's going to lose! As a 'successful' businessman, he should know when to cut his losses and run.

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Tokyo-EngrAUG. 17, 2016 - 08:43AM JST Mr. Townsend; I do not think people really want Trump's presidency to be ruinous

I've heard people on the alt-right cheering for Trump specifically because they want to see the institution of democracy destroyed and think he's the most likely to do it.

As for the article:

I'm loving turns of phrase like "preposterous panaceas" and "nostrums", but something tells me "elitist" vocabulary like that isn't going to get the message across to the people most in need to hear it.

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Well it seems there are some sane Repubs left and realize (although belatedly so shouldn't be taken too seriously) that what they are doing is high treason of the first order and are rapidly becoming the worst breed ever in US history, possibly on the same level as the traitor Rebs

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Mr. Townsend.....I guess I missed those posts (seriously) where people indicated they wanted the system taken down. People making that claim probably do not really understand what that means - anarchy in a country where most people are armed (such as the U.S.) - not a good outcome. I saw that first hand and I think most people do not realize what that really means. Hell on earth.

As you said like you and me people want to see the wealth gap closed. Unfortunately political partisanship makes many Americans blind to the fact that we (Americans) probably see things the same way on perhaps 75% of the issues and if we remove politics from the equation and try to calm the emotions I believe most Americans could engage in civil discourse and figure out how to work things out.

I am older now but when I was younger I confess to being drawn in to the "red" vs. "blue" arguments. As I age I see both parties being more and more alike and thus the United States of America has in fact become a corporatocracy.

Also you bring up the very good question; how do we get from the radical wealth divide that exists now and the corporatocracy that exists now to a place where we can rebuild the middle class and close the wealth gap to a reasonable level? No way in heck Trump will do this and I do not believe Ms. Clinton will do this either.

With Ms. Clinton we will get more of the same (and I do not mean same of President Obama only...I mean a continuation of Bush, William Clinton, and Bush Sr.) and with Mr. Trump what we are going to get is total uncertainty as he has been proven to be completely unpredictable and unstable.

My guess is most people posting on this website (including those calling each other names or tossing barbs) probably want the same things out of life and if politics were removed from the table could probably have a good sit down and come up with some pretty good ideas. Unfortunately the system/environment that has been created in the United States hinders this to the point where it may never happen.

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The signatories to the letter included Michael Green, who served as President George W. Bush’s top Asia adviser at the White House, James Clad, a former deputy assistant secretary of defense, and Patrick Cronin, a former senior official at the U.S. Agency for International Development.

they have done a great job of keeping Asian countries onside and of standing up to China.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

serendipitous, I've mused about this before. Absentee ballots will be sent by certain states in late September, marking the beginning of the end of campaigning; most states require ballots to be finalized by October. If Trump pulls out after that, the GOP will be left with no candidate and no recourse.

Not that it matters - in fact, the RNC would probably be pleased with such a turn as it would relive them of the burden of accepting responsibility for an historic defeat. Whatever happens will be enjoyable to watch.

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Seems obvious to me. Trump has no idea what is going on in Asia. He has no idea how geopolitics in this area of the world have evolved over the last 70 years, and no idea why. He has no sense that the US benefits from its alliance with Japan, and no sense that the whole region benefits from that alliance.

I am reasonably sure that does not understand the importance of capital flows to and from the US and this region, and their global importance.

Not only that, I am reasonably sure that he will not just "leave well enough alone" and restrain himself from doing something that could lead to disaster for this whole region. Even if he had good advisers, he would not listen to them.

So yeah. A Trump presidency would be a mess for Asia. It is a pretty strong assertion, but perfectly supportable.

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Political "elites" knowing they will get no jobs in a Trump administration just trying to curry favor with the other side for future considerations.

Pretty clear to me and it helps Trump that these types of people don't support him.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

"Ruinous" would only be par for the course, and continue the poor work implemented by our current and previous presidents. Republican and democrat politicians have been ruining America, and harming the rest of the world for decades, I find it hard to believe that Trump could do a worse job than they have done.

The more the political establishment bashes Trump, the more I like him. The arch-hag Hillary is the poster-child for the establishment, the ultimate tell-the-people-what-they-want-to-hear hypocrite politician, who cares nothing for any other person or thing except for her personal greed. No one has more personally profited from the selling of influence and favors than Hillary has, no one is a greater example of what is wrong in American politics than Hillary. Let's compare the tax returns from Trump with those of the Clinton Foundation, and see which stink worse.

People have to get past "republican" and "democrat", and realize that they are two sides of the same coin. Black sheep and white sheep are still sheep, but are manipulated by their elected shepherds into hating each other with "social issues" which are essentially irrelevant to either's well-being. This way they so busy calling each other names that they don't realize they are being sheared or slaughtered by the very shepherds they depend on to protect them.

Funny to read sheep-written posts above. Keep bleating boys and girls.

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I've heard people on the alt-right cheering for Trump specifically because they want to see the institution of democracy destroyed and think he's the most likely to do it.

I doubt that. They may be actually be cheering for the institution of democracy to be restored... by way of destroying current political institutions that are sinking the country. Yes, it's dangerous to go this route, but revolution is inevitable when the ruling classes go to far. And make no mistake, America has a ruling class every bit as dominant as empires of the past. It is open to newcomers, but laws are made to protect the wealthy and keep the working class down.

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but laws are made to protect the wealthy and keep the working class down.

It's always been that way everywhere. We all live in some form of government slavery.

To think a Trump presidency would change this is lunacy. If anything, the working class will work harder while the rich get richer. Didn't you read the Trump's tax plan(s)?

Meanwhile even Republicans are writing letters demanding the RNC cease funding Trump. Foreign policy experts - all of them - basically say what is obvious; that he's an ill-informed, dangerous lunatic.

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Unfortunately the system/environment that has been created in the United States hinders this to the point where it may never happen.

"Both sides do it." Riiiiiiiiight.

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Regarding this "elites ruining democracy" thing. It has been a mantra since the Reagan years that we ought to have smaller government, and we should be more democratic, less taxes, yada yada yada.

I used to be a part of that movement, and I know how ultimately empty it is. Somebody really should remind everyone that this distrust of anyone who makes a career out of diplomacy or who makes money from trade, etc., well, they are the experts. That is what EXPERT means. I also need to put forward that democratizing things is just a buzzword for chaos and ineptitude.

If you look around Asia, you can see that the WORST kind of governance and foreign policy is the kind of populist movement you see in the Philippines and to some degree in Korea, and to a greater degree in China. Grabbing someone else's territory and just paying attention to your own interests is 100% democratic and 100% nationalistic, but it is counterproductive, cheap, and eventually dangerous. On the other hand, treaties, negotiation, extended talks, mutual aid, cooperation... all those things take diplomatic professionals and a lot of time and resources. Those kinds of processes are sensitive, vulnerable, and ... frankly easy targets for opportunists to destroy.

I want professionals involved in Asian policy. I trust them. Yes they are elites and yes they funnel money in and out of the process to keep things going, but in exchange for that, we get stable and improved trade and good relations with neighboring countries. That is worth paying some taxes for. Can it be improved upon? Of course. And that is happening every day. The process has been improved consistently for over 70 years now.

Trump and his ilk think they can do better by taking us back to the days of gunboat diplomacy and imperialistic swagger. Aside from being dangerous, such strategies are not efficient, or stable, and they provide worse outcomes for everyone in the long run. Look at what has become of Russia. The UK and China are headed down that road too. Politics and diplomacy and bureaucratic agencies seem to baffle these nationalist know-nothings popping up worldwide, so they criticize and dismiss the institutions and the framework, but those institutions have brought a very high standard of living and delegated social responsibility. It is unfortunate that some people are in such a hurry to wreck it all in a selfish frenzy.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

I used to be a part of that movement, and I know how ultimately empty it is. Somebody really should remind everyone that this distrust of anyone who makes a career out of diplomacy or who makes money from trade, etc., well, they are the experts. That is what EXPERT means.

Well, I used to believe in experts myself - the concept that people in high positions knew what they were doing. Sadly, they don't. Nobody knows anything. It was a shocking thing to learn.

And this is why a larger, hands-on government will always make things worse. (I don't argue for anarchy, but for the bare minimum of laws to protect basic human rights.) Social and economic systems will mostly arise organically, and organic systems tend to work best.

A large government inevitable tries to take control of these organic systems and forcefully mold them into some utopian ideal thought up by some handful of "experts." Then, after they have mucked things up, they convince the populace that "stable and improved trade and good relations with neighboring countries" will be impossible if they are removed. Trade and good relations in fact do not require byzantine systems and experts to manage everything.

Is Trump dangerous? Yes. But continuing on the same path is even more dangerous in the long run. Washington needs disruption, and Trump may provide that.

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The Donald Trump Phenomenon is fast expiring. Unless the GOP replaces him with Paul Ryan then Hillary will be the next USA president.

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